Pinnacle's 13-01 Award
 

Thoughts?

This was a MASSIVE displacement notice which was forecasting a large amount of downgrades, but everyone held onto their seat. Why did they not award secondary displacements? The math doesn't work.

Ah man I gotta work?

Secondaries.

secondaries?

The company I think stated that it wanted to absorb as many secondary displacements as possible (maybe to reduce some cost). I found it shocking that MSP is now the junior FO base!

Praise the Lord! To be fair, that comes at a cost to other guys whose bases are closing :(

+1

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Yup, it seems most of the closed bases flocked to DTW for some reason. I am surprised more didn't go to JFK for the better relative seniority.

I really meant to quote the original poster before. I'm very glad to see there weren't a lot of downgrades (or furloughs yet for that matter.) Better than I had imagined. To be sure, I wasn't gloating over the hardships everyone has been through, especially in light of the recent base closures.

Commute from MEM to JFK is horrible. I think there's one non-stop from MEM-JFK now and everything else is on FedEx. There's a few flights into LGA, but last time I checked they were all MD-88s. There's more flights on bigger airplanes to DTW. Problem is either DTW, MSP or JFK, you're gonna get jammed up with all the commuters out of MEM. I'd imagine a lot will give up and move.

That's true. But one will still have to balance the expected date of furlough with any potential move. The 850-900 are fine long term, but in the short term there's really no good solution for the rest.

At this point, I doubt we are going to furlough. The company has already said no furloughs in 2013. The new CEO was in the crew room this morning and hinted that the 200s are staying much longer than anticipated along with the new 900s coming. He also said it is possible we may have to hire at some point.

The 200s must be removed as the 900s are added.

But but......Lee Moak thinks that might cost ALPA jobs....

Well, he signed the Delta pilot's contract. ;)

They have to make it sound good right now, they can't have most of ATL and MEM quit on them yet. They need everyone around til early 2014 then watch the tune change.

Correction, "50 seaters" must be removed as the 900s are added.

And your management has never weaseled out of contract provisions?

I'm just asking...

Real question here. If they reconfigure the 200's to have less than 50 seats, must they be removed? Is it possible that Pinnacle could fly 200's with 49 seats and not violate the provisions of the conditions for acquiring additional 900's?

No. It's not possible.

Why remove a seat when you can just put a DO NOT OCCUPY placard on one of them (like Republic does with the Frontier E-190 to meet scope requirements)?

Anywho, I'd just go with the facts. All these positive spins from the new management team have no merit until there is something legit to back 'em up.

I am not to versed on the Delta SCOPE, but one would think the language would read unto 50 seats or 50 seats or less. APA was burned with this already and that's how the E140 was born, built specifically for AMR as a way around SCOPE.

Pinnacle had the CRJ-440 , a 44 seat version with closets for the rest of the space. Then after the NWA bankruptcy and scope relaxing in 06 they all were converted to 50 seat CRJ-200s

Oh, you mean they bluffed you guys into taking a massive pay cut (and screwing the rest of us) after all? Say it ain't so! Enjoy that 7 year contract at the bottom of the industry.

Ok, so are you implying that other 50 seat operators will be reduced instead? Or are you implying that seats can be removed and will not count as 50 seaters? If its the latter, that won't work. A 50 seater is defined as an aircraft certified for 50 or less seats and a certificated MGTOW of up to 65,000 LBS.

With the agreement in place removing Pinnacle's CRJ200s is the cleanest way to remove 50 seaters from the DCI fleet.

No. Not in my experience.


No. The definition of 50 seater aircraft won't permit that.

Correct.

We learned from that. The definition of a 50 seater is 0-50 seats. If one or more seats were removed to reduce the seat count below 50 then it's still a 50 seater.

Actually, they don't have to be down to 125 50 seaters until taking delivery of the 223rd 76 seater. Bet you they only get 222 of them. Oops.

ahh yes more productive input from Uncle Tony, who was sitting in on the negotiations and has personally seen all the financial and planning documents and had Thanksgiving dinner with Spanjers and Anderson...

And? That contributed absolutely nothing to this discussion except to pump your ego by bragging that you're some union insider "big shot". Are you saying that they ARE going to furlough because the -200s ARE really leaving? Or are you just attacking me for saying something you didn't like, regardless of whether it's true or not?

didn't realize paying 1.95% and getting a magazine and occasional sticker/luggage tag made me a insider big shot, but thanks. Or do you not know how to read and you think I had dinner with them? ...pumping my ego? Pot meet kettle.

Don't worry, you'll get you 717's and mad dogs, and we'll shrink as you want

Correct. But as soon as they exceed 153 76 seaters, 50 seaters must be removed at the ratio shown below.

1) 2.7 50 seat aircraft for each of the first additional ten 76-seat aircraft (above 153)

2) 2.7 50-seat aircraft for each of the next additional ten 76-seat aircraft (above 163)

3) 2.8 50-seat aircraft for each of the next additional ten 76-seat aircraft (above 173)

4) 2.9 50-seat aircraft for each of the next additional ten 76-seat aircraft (above 183)

5) 3.0 50-seat aircraft for each of the next additional ten 76-seat aircraft (above 193)

6) 3.1 50-seat aircraft for each of the next additional ten 76-seat aircraft (above 203)

7) 4.6 50-seat aircraft for each of the next additional ten 76-seat aircraft (above 213)

I think you guys screwed yourselves since you had from February 2011 until almost Christmas of 2012 to get a contract.

The 2011 JCBA that Pinnacle signed, was, thanks to a real negotiating team consisting of Mesaba pilots, one of the fastest negotiated contracts in ALPA history. Of course, then you guys could not agree on PBS.

This is America though, where failures are always someone else's fault.

Awe that's adorable.

first and last sentences are correct, but let's be realistic about something....the only reason we got the joint contract so fast was because 1. 9e had already been through 6 years of negotiations, 2. The company needed the combined list, and 3. they knew it would be null and void within a year. Not because XJ was a dream team.

Ok............

I can read just fine. Your passive-aggressive rant was attempting to make you look like you had inside info, when in reality you're a poor line schmuck like the rest of us. The difference, is that I wouldn't vote in a pay cut.

How many 76 seaters are there today in DAL paint?

Last count I had was 153. IDK if that has changed with the 16 CRJ900s being removed from 9Es fleet.

my point exactly. It was not meant to make me look like I had inside info, where you came up with that is beyond me. You didn't have any info either, so don't tell us what we should have done. Look at 97% of your posts and tell me who is king of aggressive rants?

The 16 9E -900s are just changing hands. The fleet count for Delta overall should stay the same.