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-   -   The Debacle of the RLA and a CBA (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/regional/76487-debacle-rla-cba.html)

Flyby1206 08-11-2013 03:38 PM


Originally Posted by NoLightOff (Post 1460800)
Why rely on a union when you can take matters into your own hands. Union can't organize a walk out. Companies are at the mercy of the pilots organizing. In the age of Facebook and other social media like this it shouldn't be too hard. Just someone anonymously coming on here and saying sick out every other Tuesday until we get a better contract.

What am I missing? Why wouldn't that work? Why hasn't it been done?

That would work if everyone on the line is really unified and ****ed about the contract negotiations. Something needs to happen, pick a date a month or so away and spread the word. Good luck to the RAH pilot group.

Magpuller 08-11-2013 04:03 PM

I'm not labor attorney but I do know that such an event would be an illegal job action. So if RAH pilots did this while the IBT still practiced a policy of RLA compliance then the pilot group would be liable in a law suit by management. A sick out would be annoyance but in my opinion nothing short of a total walk-out would give them any leverage. Sick-outs will just cause a political and legal fustercluck for that PG. It would make a point but it won't hamstring management potently enough to leverage suit protection like a walk out would. The PG has to be willing to risk a permanent RAH shutdown and job loss for any stand up action that defys the RLA.

ross9238 08-11-2013 04:36 PM

The only reason that Spirit was able to strike was because they are not providing as much lift as any of the legacies or maybe even some majors and regionals (not sure of the numbers). The strike would've never happened if it was at one of the above.

Flyby1206 08-11-2013 05:11 PM


Originally Posted by ross9238 (Post 1460836)
The only reason that Spirit was able to strike was because they are not providing as much lift as any of the legacies or maybe even some majors and regionals (not sure of the numbers). The strike would've never happened if it was at one of the above.

Exactly. The big regionals like RAH have created environments where they would never be released from the NMB. It would be catastrophic for legacy airlines to lose feed overnight like that.

And like the other poster said, a wildcat strike would cause lawsuits against the union. That's why there has to be a vote to decertify the union, then an immediate walkout. No lawsuit, nobody can do anything about it. But it would take some serious cajones by the union leadership at RAH to publicly get this ball rolling.

flynavyj 08-11-2013 05:27 PM


Originally Posted by NoLightOff (Post 1460800)
Why rely on a union when you can take matters into your own hands. Union can't organize a walk out. Companies are at the mercy of the pilots organizing. In the age of Facebook and other social media like this it shouldn't be too hard. Just someone anonymously coming on here and saying sick out every other Tuesday until we get a better contract.

What am I missing? Why wouldn't that work? Why hasn't it been done?

sick outs, and walk outs are technically illegal job actions, not allowed by the RLA...if someone wanted to find out who started/organized the sick out, you might find yourself fired as a result...the good news is they can't fire everyone, just not enough folks out there to replace an entire pilot force.

As to the PATCO reference, I highly doubt there'd be any presidential firings taking place...if you worked for the federal government, you'd be out of a job...but eh, you're a private citizen, working for a private company...if you choose to stop showing up to work, no one can force you to do so. Just gotta pray that your peeps have balls and can stick to the strike...if folks started going back to work, it shows division in the workforce, and you'll just be separated and conquered by the company.

DryMotorBoatin 08-11-2013 05:44 PM

You don't need to resort to illegal methods. Just fly the contract. Nothing more nothing less. If you're sick call in sick. If your fatigued call in fatigued. Don't ask for directs. If the plane is broken wrte it up. Do this job like it should be done and you can legally send a real strong message when the system screaches to a halt.

NoLightOff 08-11-2013 06:17 PM


Originally Posted by DryMotorBoatin (Post 1460875)
You don't need to resort to illegal methods. Just fly the contract. Nothing more nothing less. If you're sick call in sick. If your fatigued call in fatigued. Don't ask for directs. If the plane is broken wrte it up. Do this job like it should be done and you can legally send a real strong message when the system screaches to a halt.

Hate to disagree but that's not good enough.
Fly the contract? That's what sucks and needs to be changed. Not to mention, the company breaks the contract and all you can do is grieve it. What a joke grievances are. All the other stuff you mentioned has no effect unless it's done in masses. You want to get the company's attention, hit them where it hurts. Cost them money and they will take notice.

flynavyj 08-11-2013 06:38 PM

Always seems ok until the last day of a four day...when the guy sitting in the "big $$" seat says "I wanna get home, and i'll be d*mned if i miss my commute"!

Magpuller 08-11-2013 07:09 PM


Originally Posted by DryMotorBoatin (Post 1460875)
You don't need to resort to illegal methods. Just fly the contract. Nothing more nothing less. If you're sick call in sick. If your fatigued call in fatigued. Don't ask for directs. If the plane is broken wrte it up. Do this job like it should be done and you can legally send a real strong message when the system screaches to a halt.

Unfortunately and believe it or not there is precedent that would make what you are suggesting a job action. If a PG suddenly changes they way they operate and it negatively impacts operations its a job action. Even when it means doing everything by the book.

There is only one answer..an illegal strike consequences be damned. But thats easy for me to say when its not my income at stake...I'd like to think I'd support such a thing if I were there...hard to say. Those guys are in a tough spot.

frankwasright 08-11-2013 08:32 PM


Originally Posted by Flyby1206 (Post 1460855)
Exactly. The big regionals like RAH have created environments where they would never be released from the NMB. It would be catastrophic for legacy airlines to lose feed overnight like that.

And like the other poster said, a wildcat strike would cause lawsuits against the union. That's why there has to be a vote to decertify the union, then an immediate walkout. No lawsuit, nobody can do anything about it. But it would take some serious cajones by the union leadership at RAH to publicly get this ball rolling.

Hahaha,not quite.Decertify the union...So who is your bargaining agent ? No lawsuit ? Dream on.The company would sue a few sacrificial lambs.Can you afford a lawyer to defend you ? So you then have NO union and thus,NO contract .The company would be free to impose pay/work rules.Sure,you can illegally shut the company down,do you think that would go unpunished ? They can wait longer than you.Do you have bills to pay ?


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