A regional for life...
11-18-2013 | 11:45 PM
#32
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 328
Likes: 0
Whoa Nelly... this thread is starting to spiral. I like the idea of staying at a regional long term. The bases are usually smaller, crews are certainly smaller and you fly together for the whole trip. You fly to small towns and get to know the gate agents and even the hotel van drivers. The hotels aren't always as nice but it seems like they give you more, like beater bikes to explore around town. That's what I miss the most about regional flying. What I can't tolerate is that first officer pay is not sustainable. Never has been and everyone knows it. It's the gorilla in the corner of the room. We pretend to ignore it because we convince our selves that an upgrade is just a short wait away. We're our own worst enemy. The bright eyes of young new pilots reflect the same public misperception that airline pay is based on the staggering salaries of wide body captains. The painful truth is that even if you're fortunate enough to get there, when you average out the long years the pay is far less. This explains why an airline pilot can track down a happy hour, free breakfast or USA Today from miles away.
Another point dully noted is that regional flying (although at one time its own brand) is now a subsidiary of a larger carrier. So the flying done today by one regional could be taken away when the contract ends to the next lowest bidder.
But where do you draw the line? Midwest Express was an airline with a great product and loyal customers and it was not a regional. Is it a risk to pursue a boutique airline because you want to live in a certain region or you prefer a smaller airline culture? Is it safer to work for a giant legacy... to have power in numbers? What about the giants of yesterday such as Pan Am, Eastern, TWA? How much impact does a CEO or board of directors have on your career?
I think the answer is, you're never safe. We are all free agents and even the best of intentions could be dashed away by bankruptcy, a bad merger or another Lorenzo-type spin off taking command of your company.
Another point dully noted is that regional flying (although at one time its own brand) is now a subsidiary of a larger carrier. So the flying done today by one regional could be taken away when the contract ends to the next lowest bidder.
But where do you draw the line? Midwest Express was an airline with a great product and loyal customers and it was not a regional. Is it a risk to pursue a boutique airline because you want to live in a certain region or you prefer a smaller airline culture? Is it safer to work for a giant legacy... to have power in numbers? What about the giants of yesterday such as Pan Am, Eastern, TWA? How much impact does a CEO or board of directors have on your career?
I think the answer is, you're never safe. We are all free agents and even the best of intentions could be dashed away by bankruptcy, a bad merger or another Lorenzo-type spin off taking command of your company.
11-19-2013 | 04:05 AM
#33
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 946
Likes: 0
From: Right Seat 744
I'm a 9 year SkyWest Captain, 33, married with 3 kids. I'm based at home, senior on reserve and don't get called a lot most months of the year. If I want some extra money I can fly on my days off. My wife has a very good job, so the extra money I would make working for a major isn't that big of a deal........ most likely be trying to leave.
And to Viper, very big congrats to you. But, what happens if your wife looses her job for any reason (god forbid)? Just things to think about.
11-19-2013 | 06:24 AM
#34
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 45,134
Likes: 797
From: Engines Turn or People Swim
They go in cycles. The ones growing today will be shrinking (or BK) in a few years. That's the way the system is supposed to work. You hungry pilots (most looking to build time for the majors) will work for cheap. After they've been there a few years, get tired of ramen, get married, kids, mortgages, college to save for, etc they naturally expect more money...at least more than food stamp wages. At this point the major partner shifts the flying to a new group, which can hitre young hungry pilots off the street.
As for the old pilot group? They can try to get jobs at majors, start over as an FO at another regional, or go to take a flying leap...it's all good as far as management is concerned.
The problem with this whole scheme today is that with the RJ boom there are now a lot more regional pilots than there are available mainline jobs.
11-19-2013 | 11:32 AM
#35
Da Hudge
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,473
Likes: 0
From: Poodle Whisperer
Whatever the answer is, it'll be the opposite in just a few short years. My regional doubled in size when I was there. Now, even after merging with 2 other regionals, the total pilot count is falling down to what it was when I left.
Unless you're 55, planning to hang your hat at a carrier that makes it's money off of outsourced flying is a poor career investment.
Unless you're 55, planning to hang your hat at a carrier that makes it's money off of outsourced flying is a poor career investment.
11-19-2013 | 02:43 PM
#38
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,459
Likes: 0
Whoa Nelly... this thread is starting to spiral. I like the idea of staying at a regional long term. The bases are usually smaller, crews are certainly smaller and you fly together for the whole trip. You fly to small towns and get to know the gate agents and even the hotel van drivers. The hotels aren't always as nice but it seems like they give you more, like beater bikes to explore around town. That's what I miss the most about regional flying. What I can't tolerate is that first officer pay is not sustainable. Never has been and everyone knows it. It's the gorilla in the corner of the room. We pretend to ignore it because we convince our selves that an upgrade is just a short wait away. We're our own worst enemy. The bright eyes of young new pilots reflect the same public misperception that airline pay is based on the staggering salaries of wide body captains. The painful truth is that even if you're fortunate enough to get there, when you average out the long years the pay is far less. This explains why an airline pilot can track down a happy hour, free breakfast or USA Today from miles away.
Another point dully noted is that regional flying (although at one time its own brand) is now a subsidiary of a larger carrier. So the flying done today by one regional could be taken away when the contract ends to the next lowest bidder.
But where do you draw the line? Midwest Express was an airline with a great product and loyal customers and it was not a regional. Is it a risk to pursue a boutique airline because you want to live in a certain region or you prefer a smaller airline culture? Is it safer to work for a giant legacy... to have power in numbers? What about the giants of yesterday such as Pan Am, Eastern, TWA? How much impact does a CEO or board of directors have on your career?
I think the answer is, you're never safe. We are all free agents and even the best of intentions could be dashed away by bankruptcy, a bad merger or another Lorenzo-type spin off taking command of your company.
Another point dully noted is that regional flying (although at one time its own brand) is now a subsidiary of a larger carrier. So the flying done today by one regional could be taken away when the contract ends to the next lowest bidder.
But where do you draw the line? Midwest Express was an airline with a great product and loyal customers and it was not a regional. Is it a risk to pursue a boutique airline because you want to live in a certain region or you prefer a smaller airline culture? Is it safer to work for a giant legacy... to have power in numbers? What about the giants of yesterday such as Pan Am, Eastern, TWA? How much impact does a CEO or board of directors have on your career?
I think the answer is, you're never safe. We are all free agents and even the best of intentions could be dashed away by bankruptcy, a bad merger or another Lorenzo-type spin off taking command of your company.
Can we even call this a career then? Doesn't the word "career" express the idea of one exercising their profession in a steady predictable manner of progression? Doesn't the word convey improving one's position in life over time as they advance in their "career" Doesn't the idea of career and some semblance of stability go hand in hand?
I contend that the idea of a "career" for everyone, is a relatively novel concept anyway, and may not have a lasting place in history. Careers have existed forever, but in history only a small percentage of the elite have enjoyed them. The rest were simply workers - and they have always been expendable. We don't have careers - we have a skill set with which to work.
The men & women who hold our fate in their hands are the ones with careers. No?
11-19-2013 | 02:59 PM
#39
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 758
Likes: 0
With 30+ years left in my career it would be hard to say I'm committing to being a lifer here. I have no desire to leave in the near future but I am constantly evaluating that decision. There's always change in this industry, who knows what SkyWest will look like in 5, 10, 20 years. Up until a year or so ago I was trying to leave. It was the increase in QOL that made me want to stay.
11-19-2013 | 03:54 PM
#40
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,122
Likes: 0
From: A-320
Get out while you are still relatively young. If you wait a few years to finally make the move then you will be wishing that you had done it sooner. Delta is gearing up to hire 600 a year. Most legacies have significant retirements in the next decade. The longer you wait, the more people get ahead of you. I was a decent line holding captain at a regional when i left. I do not regret leaving for a second.
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