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Actual text of RAH TA
The actual RAH/IBT tentative agreement, in two PDFs.
http://www.mediafire.com/view/kua5pi...2-14-part1.pdf http://www.mediafire.com/view/g2aems...2-14-part2.pdf |
This thing is concessionary in most areas. All members of the nc need to be removed. A certain member of the mec needs to be recalled, and rick dubinski needs to take a flying leap. I never dreamed it would be so over the top bad.
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What a joke... Bedford is out trying to sell this as industry leading contract. WRONG. It's an industry leading joke... what a piece of garbage.
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it IS an industry leading contract.
God Bless, B |
Originally Posted by BBedford
(Post 1593675)
it IS an industry leading contract.
God Bless, B |
Why a lower pay scale for the same airplane configured with four less seats?
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Why only a 1 percent COLA each year? Inflation is closer to 3 percent. Does your healthcare go down every year or something? That is the lowest COLA I have ever seen in a contract.
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Inflation rate is closer to 1.5% for the last 2 years. No dog in this fight just thought I would mention it.
Current Inflation Rates | Monthly and Yearly Chart, Graph and Table: 2004-2014 Data - US Inflation Calculator |
Originally Posted by theken
(Post 1593753)
Inflation rate is closer to 1.5% for the last 2 years. No dog in this fight just thought I would mention it.
Current Inflation Rates | Monthly and Yearly Chart, Graph and Table: 2004-2014 Data - US Inflation Calculator |
I'm a no vote
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I have never seen an engineering diagram (flow chart) on how you get paid. :eek:
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Originally Posted by hockeypilot44
(Post 1593749)
Why only a 1 percent COLA each year? Inflation is closer to 3 percent. Does your healthcare go down every year or something? That is the lowest COLA I have ever seen in a contract.
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I'm a YES vote
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Originally Posted by Loon
(Post 1593920)
I'm a YES vote
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Originally Posted by Chuck D
(Post 1593928)
Care to explain your reasoning, or is my sarcasm detector out of calibration?
Is the ta utipia? NO! Is RAH Delta? NO! Signing bonus blows. Good things, bad things. If we vote no, how much longer will we have to wait for something else? 6 months, 12 months? All the while the ibt357 will continue to STEAL my money in the guise of an assessment. I get it though as those trips to Jackson Hole don't pay for themselves. I am most surely a YES vote! |
Its cute you think the assessment will stop if we vote this in. The union will keep taking your money, only youll have no hope of a decent contract ever again. Now or never for rah pilots. I hope very feware as short sighted and ignorant as you seem to be.
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Originally Posted by Loon
(Post 1593934)
No, no sarcasm here.
Is the ta utipia? NO! Is RAH Delta? NO! Signing bonus blows. Good things, bad things. If we vote no, how much longer will we have to wait for something else? 6 months, 12 months? All the while the ibt357 will continue to STEAL my money in the guise of an assessment. I get it though as those trips to Jackson Hole don't pay for themselves. I am most surely a YES vote! |
Originally Posted by Loon
(Post 1593934)
No, no sarcasm here.
Is the ta utipia? NO! Is RAH Delta? NO! Signing bonus blows. Good things, bad things. If we vote no, how much longer will we have to wait for something else? 6 months, 12 months? All the while the ibt357 will continue to STEAL my money in the guise of an assessment. I get it though as those trips to Jackson Hole don't pay for themselves. I am most surely a YES vote! |
Originally Posted by Loon
(Post 1593934)
No, no sarcasm here.
Is the ta utipia? NO! Is RAH Delta? NO!
Originally Posted by Loon
(Post 1593934)
Signing bonus blows. Good things, bad things.
Originally Posted by Loon
(Post 1593934)
If we vote no, how much longer will we have to wait for something else? 6 months, 12 months?
Right now this contract doesn't even cover the inflation from the 2003 CBA. The Company is desperate to get this contract done. They'll be just as desperate after we vote this one down. I'd rather wait six months to a year for a decent contract to work under for the next seven years than start a crappy contract tomorrow.
Originally Posted by Loon
(Post 1593934)
All the while the ibt357 will continue to STEAL my money in the guise of an assessment. I get it though as those trips to Jackson Hole don't pay for themselves. I am most surely a YES vote!
How can I resign my union membership? | National Right to Work Legal Defense Foundation Of course, after you do that you don't get to vote yes, or no, on any contract, LOA, etc. |
Originally Posted by WeaselBoy
(Post 1593955)
I'd rather wait six months to a year for a decent contract to work under for the next seven years than start a crappy contract tomorrow. -------> Look for the "Weasel-Words". For every clause, think how it will work out in the "fly it, then grieve it" world we live in. If it is an improvement for you, be damn sure that it is airtight. Front to back, sideways, inside-out and backwards. And..... like XJT, EGL, etc: why is the company finally motivated to get this done, quickly??? |
Originally Posted by flyguy23
(Post 1593945)
Its cute you think the assessment will stop if we vote this in. The union will keep taking your money, only youll have no hope of a decent contract ever again. Now or never for rah pilots. I hope very feware as short sighted and ignorant as you seem to be.
Btw, I voted NO on assessment, did you? |
Originally Posted by WeaselBoy
(Post 1593955)
Utipia? Is that when UltiPro works perfectly?
Signing bonus needs to be above what they are giving to the new hires off the street. Period. And? I'm willing to send this back to the Company to get it fixed. This will easily be a seven year contract, if not ten. I get we are not going to have a mainline contract, but at the end of the day, my paycheck needs to be slightly higher than what SkyWest is making now. Right now this contract doesn't even cover the inflation from the 2003 CBA. The Company is desperate to get this contract done. They'll be just as desperate after we vote this one down. I'd rather wait six months to a year for a decent contract to work under for the next seven years than start a crappy contract tomorrow. We pay the least amount of dues than any other unionized carrier. If you feel that is too much, you can resign your union membership at any time. How can I resign my union membership? | National Right to Work Legal Defense Foundation Of course, after you do that you don't get to vote yes, or no, on any contract, LOA, etc. |
Originally Posted by Loon
(Post 1593920)
I'm a YES vote
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Someone correct me if I am wrong but are FOs all on one pay scale regardless of aircraft size? IMO they should get pay increases with size just like captains.
Is there a summary or bullet points anywhere? I'm not at rjet and don't want to read the whole thing but I am currious.. Looks like you guys at least got cancellation pay finally! Is your credit the greater of scheduled or actual block per leg? What about duty and trip rigs? 100% deadhead pay? IMO your focus should be on credits... Pay rate improvements don't help much if you can't claim it and signing bonuses are quickly forgotten over the span of a contract. |
We did not get cx pay. We got a very watered down version of cx pay. Trip and duty rigs are completely worthless. They added them in only to have the ability to say we got rigs. They will serve no purpose. This ta fell badly short to the point the nc and an mec member need to be removed from their positions.
Also, I did vote no to the assessment. Im not willing to vote yes on a horrific ta because I hate the union. There is no doubt in my mind these guys will get a large kickback from the company if they deliver a yes vote. You are helping the guys you hate by voting yes. |
Originally Posted by Loon
(Post 1594056)
Sad, but true. The assessment WILL continue! But I have an axe to grind with this union and the NC. They are a crooked bunch and I will cut off my nose to spite my face. Misery loves company. No more cush trips for them. They can all kiss my a$$.
Btw, I voted NO on assessment, did you? Voting yes or no won't stop union dues or union politics. |
It's difficult to understand why unions send our garbage TAs to the group, when even the MEC/exec council doesn't support them.
You guys deserve a lot more than this contract $$$$$ http://www.blogcdn.com/jobs.aol.com/...bedford293.jpg |
Inflation is up 8.6 percent from 2008 to 2014. You need that much of a raise just to get back to the buying power of your current contract when it ended. Never mind the money lost over the last 6 years. What about your health insurance? Has it risen more than 8.6 percent over the last 6 years? Your buying power keeps getting worse and worse every year. It seems this job is only getting worse as time goes by. I read this TA. Those trip and duty rigs are so bad they are non-existent. They only time they will kick in is if everything is cancelled and even then the pay will be minimal.
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Originally Posted by Loon
(Post 1594056)
Sad, but true. The assessment WILL continue! But I have an axe to grind with this union and the NC. They are a crooked bunch and I will cut off my nose to spite my face. Misery loves company. No more cush trips for them. They can all kiss my a$$.
Btw, I voted NO on assessment, did you? |
The company wants this done asap. They've dragged this out for 6 years because they could and it was to their advantage to do so. Now the tables are turned. They need this done, with mostly improvements on the FO side. Signing bonuses aren't even bringing people in the door. They know they need improvements to keep the operation going. You think they want to shrink CHQ? This TA is just the minimum they're willing to give to the group to accomplish this, hoping to get 51%. Vote no, and they'll come back with something better. Nobody can take anymore flying right now, finally the whipsaw is dying. Follow Xjet and Eagle's lead and you will be rewarded. Force their costs higher and higher to the point mainline takes back the flying, which is what we all want.
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Originally Posted by Loon
(Post 1594056)
Sad, but true. The assessment WILL continue! But I have an axe to grind with this union and the NC. They are a crooked bunch and I will cut off my nose to spite my face. Misery loves company. No more cush trips for them. They can all kiss my a$$.
Btw, I voted NO on assessment, did you? |
Originally Posted by Pilotpip
(Post 1594100)
Maybe you should have been a little less apathetic and considered running for a position instead of letting this group be appointed. Out of 2000+ they are the only ones that were willing. You're getting exactly what you didn't care to vote for.
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Originally Posted by ThrustMonkey
(Post 1594128)
You can't fix stupid. Good luck RAH bro's keeping this lack of foresight mentality from banding together and voting in that joke of a TA.
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Originally Posted by WeaselBoy
(Post 1593955)
Utipia? Is that when UltiPro works perfectly?
Signing bonus needs to be above what they are giving to the new hires off the street. Period. And? I'm willing to send this back to the Company to get it fixed. This will easily be a seven year contract, if not ten. I get we are not going to have a mainline contract, but at the end of the day, my paycheck needs to be slightly higher than what SkyWest is making now. Right now this contract doesn't even cover the inflation from the 2003 CBA. The Company is desperate to get this contract done. They'll be just as desperate after we vote this one down. I'd rather wait six months to a year for a decent contract to work under for the next seven years than start a crappy contract tomorrow. We pay the least amount of dues than any other unionized carrier. If you feel that is too much, you can resign your union membership at any time. How can I resign my union membership? | National Right to Work Legal Defense Foundation Of course, after you do that you don't get to vote yes, or no, on any contract, LOA, etc. |
8,000,000 sigining bonus. About 2200 pilots? About $3600 per pilot? That's less than the new hire bonus. Wow. This thing is atrocious. It should get voted down 95-5. IBT should be decertified for taking the companies offer and putting it in TA form without even negotiating. I love the pay freeze to let the 175's come down to the 170 rates instead of the other way around. This thing is embarrassing.
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Originally Posted by Loon
(Post 1594235)
Lack of foresight? I take it you're a f9 guy? Talk about the pot and the kettle.
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Originally Posted by spuzzyair
(Post 1594240)
You feel you deserve to be paid more than SkyWest, or you are saying in order for it to keep people from leaving and to attracting new hires it needs to pay more than SkyWest??
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Originally Posted by Loon
(Post 1594234)
You are correct indeed. What we should have done or do next time, is hire a professional. Lawyer, agent, whatever. Pilots are not good negotiators by nature.Cheapskates, booze- hounds yes, but not wheelers and dealers.
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If this is an improvement on your existing contract Lord help you. I read the whole thing.
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Originally Posted by spuzzyair
(Post 1594240)
You feel you deserve to be paid more than SkyWest, or you are saying in order for it to keep people from leaving and to attracting new hires it needs to pay more than SkyWest??
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