Originally Posted by emb145 (Post 2017136)

PDT flowing in 3 years is no more laughable than Envoy's 2.5/6. After all, it's a projection, right?

For the 2.5/6 to work, 34 upgrades per month, every month, for the next year and beyond are the numbers needed to make it happen at Envoy. Unfortunately, that's laughable.

Originally Posted by sublime259 (Post 2017167)

Me saying a 3 year flow at PDT is laughable is more of a jab at people such as yourself who continue to criticize envoy for no particular reason, while leaving PDT untouched. Yes...a small airline flying -8's and POSSIBLY a few beat up 145's is really something to write home about!

Originally Posted by DOGIII (Post 2017174)

Management talk is cheap, it costs them nothing to make these projections in the hopes of reeling in some fish. The truth is obviously in the middle somewhere.

Originally Posted by sublime259 (Post 2017177)

I agree with you there. Of course management is going to say whatever they can to legitimize their claim...that's their job. I'm just saying from the numbers that I've run, the numbers for envoy look legit to me (or very close to it at least.) As much as both you and I might not like to admit it, the number crunchers at AAG are a lot smarter then both you an I.

Originally Posted by eaglefly (Post 2016885)

He certainly busted his hump selling Envoy on-line. As I understand it, CDD's really put you in a pickle as you admit the accusations against you which means you're essentially on double secret probation for the remainder of your tenure. If Mason ran afoul of his tenuous employment situation and they canned him, that is truly unfortunate. I disagreed with his claims and math, but take no pleasure in someone losing their job. I heard of many pilots canned at Eagle for a wide range of infractions and most got their jobs back. Normally, I would say don't count Mason out just yet, but a existing CDD in one's file exacerbates the situation in favor of the company from what I've heard.

I wish him good luck on getting his job back and hope whatever the situation is, it can be salvaged.

Originally Posted by Mach Indicator (Post 2017675)

What's a CDD? I assume you're not referring to Christian Domestic Discipline. Look that one up if you're not aware. I just did.

Originally Posted by daOldMan (Post 2017676)

Career Decision Day.

Originally Posted by daOldMan (Post 2017676)

Career Decision Day.

Originally Posted by FirstClass (Post 2017686)

Mind games

Originally Posted by Mach Indicator (Post 2017714)

I take it, it's a day where you get to reflect on your Career Decisions?

Originally Posted by Mach Indicator (Post 2017714)

I take it, it's a day where you get to reflect on your Career Decisions?

Originally Posted by sublime259 (Post 2017177)

I agree with you there. Of course management is going to say whatever they can to legitimize their claim...that's their job. I'm just saying from the numbers that I've run, the numbers for envoy look legit to me (or very close to it at least.) As much as both you and I might not like to admit it, the number crunchers at AAG are a lot smarter then both you an I.

Originally Posted by emb145 (Post 2017838)

Do you actually believe that beginning in January, the company is going to post vacancies for 30+ CA slots on a monthly basis for 2 solid years?

Originally Posted by Rmk1991 (Post 2016951)

Can someone sum up who cujo665 is for someone out of the loop?

Originally Posted by AdiosMikeFox (Post 2018058)

An outspoken pilot who was a huge critic of the union who then became a CA rep in the union. He rattled a lot of cages, outed huge expenses by previous union officials (thereby pis sing them off, very hard feelings exist to the his day) and talked a hard line regarding daily operations suggesting many things that the company wanted to view as a "work action", like contract interpretations the company disagreed with.

He spoke his mind and had very little give as far as negotiations went and has been accused of sabotaging negotiations or doing end-runs around the union to get things done. He has been a PITA to the company by publicly and repeatedly calling them on their BS.

He's made a lot of enemies among management, former and current union members because he stepped on a lot of toes, wouldn't bend to their will and pretty much let them know it. He's also suffered due to appearing to change from a huge critic (which he still was) to pushing company propaganda about 2.5/6, which is unfortunate because we ALL know it's possible if certain conditions are met, conditions which he readily acknowledged. It earned him being called a turncoat.

All that said, he was a great CA rep IMO. Always responded quickly to questions and immediately placed himself between the pilot and the company. His uncompromising style has bent the company in our favor more often than not and his outing of a lot of information that tends to get skirted or softened by corporate/union speak has kept the pilot group well informed. He's worked hard behind the scenes getting things fixed by management by threatening to publicly criticize them.

He was placed on "probation" for allegedly abusing union/sick time off. He was busted for an alleged repeat offense. His high visibility and antagonism of the company ensured they were going be on his case instantly for anything that could be perceived as an infraction.

The short version: Outspoken CA rep ticks management and other pilots off by not staying in line, however the rep does a lot of good by shaking things up as well. Pis ses the company off repeatedly so they make sure to bust him and fire him.

Originally Posted by AdiosMikeFox (Post 2018063)

Unlike Cuj, I have the pleasure of suffering through the holidays working for an airline that falls apart as soon as the clouds fart a single snowflake. My Christmas Eve, day and new year will be spent flying a lousy 56 hour line. But hey, at least it's commutable. If I can squeeze into the oversold flights, anyway.

See you in the ORD penalty box.

Originally Posted by thefoxsays (Post 2017739)

This, and if you choose to stay employed, said person is placed on 2 yrs probation.

Since Cujo was on probation, his continued attendance abuse got him terminated.

Originally Posted by Rmk1991 (Post 2016951)

Can someone sum up who cujo665 is for someone out of the loop?

Originally Posted by AdiosMikeFox (Post 2018063)

Unlike Cuj, I have the pleasure of suffering through the holidays working for an airline that falls apart as soon as the clouds fart a single snowflake. My Christmas Eve, day and new year will be spent flying a lousy 56 hour line. But hey, at least it's commutable. If I can squeeze into the oversold flights, anyway.

See you in the ORD penalty box.

Originally Posted by AdiosMikeFox (Post 2018058)

An outspoken pilot who was a huge critic of the union who then became a CA rep in the union. He rattled a lot of cages, outed huge expenses by previous union officials (thereby pis sing them off, very hard feelings exist to the his day) and talked a hard line regarding daily operations suggesting many things that the company wanted to view as a "work action", like contract interpretations the company disagreed with.

He spoke his mind and had very little give as far as negotiations went and has been accused of sabotaging negotiations or doing end-runs around the union to get things done. He has been a PITA to the company by publicly and repeatedly calling them on their BS.

He's made a lot of enemies among management, former and current union members because he stepped on a lot of toes, wouldn't bend to their will and pretty much let them know it. He's also suffered due to appearing to change from a huge critic (which he still was) to pushing company propaganda about 2.5/6, which is unfortunate because we ALL know it's possible if certain conditions are met, conditions which he readily acknowledged. It earned him being called a turncoat.

All that said, he was a great CA rep IMO. Always responded quickly to questions and immediately placed himself between the pilot and the company. His uncompromising style has bent the company in our favor more often than not and his outing of a lot of information that tends to get skirted or softened by corporate/union speak has kept the pilot group well informed. He actively listened to and solicited opinions and positions from the pilots in his LEC, held boatloads of teleconferences to solicit and dispense information. Way better than almost any previous rep in my tenure. He's worked hard behind the scenes getting things fixed by management by threatening to publicly criticize them.

He was placed on "probation" for allegedly abusing union/sick time off. He was busted for an alleged repeat offense. His high visibility and antagonism of the company ensured they were going be on his case instantly for anything that could be perceived as an infraction.

The short version: Outspoken CA rep ticks management and other pilots off by not staying in line, however the rep does a lot of good by shaking things up as well. Pis ses the company off repeatedly so they make sure to bust him and fire him.

Originally Posted by AdiosMikeFox (Post 2018058)

An outspoken pilot who was a huge critic of the union who then became a CA rep in the union. He rattled a lot of cages, outed huge expenses by previous union officials (thereby pis sing them off, very hard feelings exist to the his day) and talked a hard line regarding daily operations suggesting many things that the company wanted to view as a "work action", like contract interpretations the company disagreed with.

He spoke his mind and had very little give as far as negotiations went and has been accused of sabotaging negotiations or doing end-runs around the union to get things done. He has been a PITA to the company by publicly and repeatedly calling them on their BS.

He's made a lot of enemies among management, former and current union members because he stepped on a lot of toes, wouldn't bend to their will and pretty much let them know it. He's also suffered due to appearing to change from a huge critic (which he still was) to pushing company propaganda about 2.5/6, which is unfortunate because we ALL know it's possible if certain conditions are met, conditions which he readily acknowledged. It earned him being called a turncoat.

All that said, he was a great CA rep IMO. Always responded quickly to questions and immediately placed himself between the pilot and the company. His uncompromising style has bent the company in our favor more often than not and his outing of a lot of information that tends to get skirted or softened by corporate/union speak has kept the pilot group well informed. He actively listened to and solicited opinions and positions from the pilots in his LEC, held boatloads of teleconferences to solicit and dispense information. Way better than almost any previous rep in my tenure. He's worked hard behind the scenes getting things fixed by management by threatening to publicly criticize them.

He was placed on "probation" for allegedly abusing union/sick time off. He was busted for an alleged repeat offense. His high visibility and antagonism of the company ensured they were going be on his case instantly for anything that could be perceived as an infraction.

The short version: Outspoken CA rep ticks management and other pilots off by not staying in line, however the rep does a lot of good by shaking things up as well. Pis ses the company off repeatedly so they make sure to bust him and fire him.

Originally Posted by Skyvector (Post 2018127)

Wow,man. Let us know what Cujo's johnson tastes like.

It's obvious you bought into his whole martyr persona hook, line, and sinker. I'm not going to change your views, but just keep in mind this:

He was a good rep on a personal pilot level. Meaning if you needed to do a carpet dance in the CPO he was a good guy to have there with you. Other than that, Cujo was a walking disaster from one end to the other.

He returned calls? That's his freakin' job as a rep!!!!!! All reps as far as I know return calls/texts. They certainly do in DFW.



Cujo did major damage to this pilot group by pushing his personal views and convincing enough people to buy into his BS. His mantra for most of 2013/2014 was that everyone on property was going to get hired off the street at mainline in 3 years or less, therefore we should scuttle the ship. The sheep bought into it and Cujo felt really proud of himself.

i think we said 5 years. Since then over 1000 have moved upwards. 600 by flow and the rest upwards. Very few choose to go lateral to chase upgrades, but some did

It wasn't until late 2014 that he realized what a mistake he had made and did an about face on his views. But good luck getting him to admit he was ever wrong. He wanted to have his cake and eat it too (pardon the pun). He continued to argue that he was right in March of 2014 with the NO vote and right in December 2014 with the YES vote....even though the December offer was worse than the March one.

the largest complaint on the March TA was no protection if flow stopped. That was fixed. Numerous other improvements if you do a side by side. But you aren't interested in facts, are you

It's one or the other....you can't have it both ways. But that is exactly what he wanted. Then there are his issues within the Union. He continually over stepped his boundaries by attempting to negotiate directly with management. It backfired on him in the Summer of 2014, he quickly retreated into the shadows and swept it under the rug.

Sam Pool who was always his ally back in the NY rep days quickly turned on him. For the past year Cujo was isolated within the Union and the only people who gave him the time of day was his fan club on Eagle Lounge. He did more damage to this pilot group than 30 people could have done if they tried.

Sam and I have been friends since long before either of us worked here. We don't always agree, but the few disagreements are usually over methods and not over ideology or goals. As for how the union works, you have a terribly short memory it seams. Our old MEC administration used to have open yelling fights at MEC meetings, degenerating to members storming out of the room. Our MEC has always functioned in a true democratic fashion with all viewpoints represented, al all viewpoints respected. The reps work well together, even when they don't always agree. The prior administrations can't say that.
Your characterization is flawed

Oh, and all of that is not even getting into his attendance abuse. Punching out on PAID Union leave just to get out of having to work is bad form to say the least. Especially when you then use that time to take a vacation to Disney. He would regularly abuse the sick call/union leave system, thereby leaving the actual work to be done by some poor pilot who had to cover for him.

not accurate at all. That is the picture the company wants to paint, but it's not true.


That is just he beginning of it. There is plenty more and the company didn't single him out. In fact they gave him one opportunity after another. The problem is he thought he was invincible and could get away with anything.

you don't think so? I've sat in on termination meetings before. Nothing like the circus I went through. I've defended guys with worse attendance records than me, and they're still there.
Oh, and I never used union leave to go on vacation to Disney, that's another lie.

Originally Posted by Skyvector (Post 2018127)

Wow,man. **********.

It's obvious you bought into his whole martyr persona hook, line, and sinker. I'm not going to change your views, but just keep in mind this:

He was a good rep on a personal pilot level. Meaning if you needed to do a carpet dance in the CPO he was a good guy to have there with you. Other than that, Cujo was a walking disaster from one end to the other.

He returned calls? That's his freakin' job as a rep!!!!!! All reps as far as I know return calls/texts. They certainly do in DFW.

Cujo did major damage to this pilot group by pushing his personal views and convincing enough people to buy into his BS. His mantra for most of 2013/2014 was that everyone on property was going to get hired off the street at mainline in 3 years or less, therefore we should scuttle the ship. The sheep bought into it and Cujo felt really proud of himself.

It wasn't until late 2014 that he realized what a mistake he had made and did an about face on his views. But good luck getting him to admit he was ever wrong. He wanted to have his cake and eat it too (pardon the pun). He continued to argue that he was right in March of 2014 with the NO vote and right in December 2014 with the YES vote....even though the December offer was worse than the March one.

It's one or the other....you can't have it both ways. But that is exactly what he wanted. Then there are his issues within the Union. He continually over stepped his boundaries by attempting to negotiate directly with management. It backfired on him in the Summer of 2014, he quickly retreated into the shadows and swept it under the rug.

Sam Pool who was always his ally back in the NY rep days quickly turned on him. For the past year Cujo was isolated within the Union and the only people who gave him the time of day was his fan club on Eagle Lounge. He did more damage to this pilot group than 30 people could have done if they tried.

Oh, and all of that is not even getting into his attendance abuse. Punching out on PAID Union leave just to get out of having to work is bad form to say the least. Especially when you then use that time to take a vacation to Disney. He would regularly abuse the sick call/union leave system, thereby leaving the actual work to be done by some poor pilot who had to cover for him.

That is just he beginning of it. There is plenty more and the company didn't single him out. In fact they gave him one opportunity after another. The problem is he thought he was invincible and could get away with anything.

Originally Posted by AdiosMikeFox (Post 2018058)

The short version: Outspoken CA rep ticks management and other pilots off by not staying in line, however the rep does a lot of good by shaking things up as well. Pis ses the company off repeatedly so they make sure to bust him and fire him.

Originally Posted by Skyvector (Post 2016922)

flying from 3 different Regionals is returning to Envoy in droves

Originally Posted by boiler07 (Post 2019559)

Ray told the CP that he wouldn't be coming into work because he needed to be with his family. (not arguing the validity of this, but that's what happened)

He then went to Disney and missed a few days of work. The company tried to say he no call/no showed for 3 days which is grounds for termination.

I'm sure he'll say I'm wrong if this isn't correct.

Originally Posted by thefoxsays (Post 2019819)

That's what put him on probation... But not why he was terminated....

Originally Posted by FlameNSky (Post 2019855)

It really isn't any of our business.