Asiana 777 Crash at SFO
02-07-2014, 12:49 PM
#871
New Hire
Joined APC: Jan 2014
Position: Furloughed
Posts: 8
Originally Posted by KC10 FATboy
My point is, I think the Airbus design makes pilots a bit lazy. I trained on a Boeing product with a buddy who spent 8 years on an Airbus. The Asiana scenario was exactly like some of the things I saw him do in the Boeing simulator. He had lost his "stick and rudder" skills .. mainly power and speed management.
02-07-2014, 03:23 PM
#872
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Legacy FO
Posts: 4,096
Originally Posted by Mal106
It certainly can make the aircrew lazy but it also doesn't have to. Some companies mistakenly encourage or even require use of automation. The Bus is a superb flying machine when you click off the automation, flies like a big fighter. A lot of guys didn't like it but most of those not liking it didn't fly it. Loosing stick and rudder skills isn't due to the Bus, it's due to the way some companies/pilots fly the Bus.....
Three competent Air France pilots deep stalled and crashed a perfectly good airplane because the Pilot Monitoring and Captain couldn't tell that the Pilot Flying was commanding full nose up -- thinking the airplane wouldn't let him stall.
This Asiana pilot was also commanding nose up while thinking the Boeing would supply power and not let him stall.
Coincidence?
02-25-2014, 03:28 PM
#873
Administrator
Joined APC: May 2006
Position: C-172
Posts: 8,024
WASHINGTON — Asiana Airlines has been fined $500,000 for failing to assist family members of passengers on a flight that crashed last year at San Francisco airport, the Transportation Department announced Tuesday.
The airline based in South Korea violated federal law in the July 6 crash in San Francisco that killed three people and injured more than 100 others, by failing to adhere to its family-assistance crash, according to the department.
The fine is the first against an airline under the Federal Air Carrier Family Support Act of 1997. Foreign airlines are supposed to publicize and staff a reliable toll-free phone number for relatives of passengers to get information after a crash.
Asiana took two full days to successfully contact the families of just three-quarters of the passengers, according to the department. The families of several passengers were not contacted until five days following the crash, the department said.
"In the very rare event of a crash, airlines have a responsibility to provide their full support to help passengers and their families by following all the elements of their family assistance plans," Transportation Secretary Anthony Foxx said in announcing the fine. "The last thing families and passengers should have to worry about at such a stressful time is how to get information from their carrier."
Spokesmen for Asiana didn't immediately respond to a request for comment.
For approximately one day following the crash, Asiana failed to widely publicize any telephone number for family members of those onboard, and the number available was a reservations line, according to the department.
The reservations line did not include a separate menu option for calls related to the crash and callers were required to navigate through cumbersome automated menus before being connected to an Asiana employee, according to the department.
Asiana also lacked translators and personnel trained in crash response, the transportation department found.
In the late 1990s, after airlines were roundly criticized for ignoring desperate requests for information after crashes, Congress required carriers to dedicate significant attention to families of passengers.
Last fall, The Associated Press reviewed plans filed by two dozen foreign airlines and found cases in which carriers had not updated their family assistance plans as required.
Since AP's story, several airlines have updated family assistance plans and filed new paperwork with the Department of Transportation. Among them is Asiana's bigger rival, Korean Air.
The airline based in South Korea violated federal law in the July 6 crash in San Francisco that killed three people and injured more than 100 others, by failing to adhere to its family-assistance crash, according to the department.
The fine is the first against an airline under the Federal Air Carrier Family Support Act of 1997. Foreign airlines are supposed to publicize and staff a reliable toll-free phone number for relatives of passengers to get information after a crash.
Asiana took two full days to successfully contact the families of just three-quarters of the passengers, according to the department. The families of several passengers were not contacted until five days following the crash, the department said.
"In the very rare event of a crash, airlines have a responsibility to provide their full support to help passengers and their families by following all the elements of their family assistance plans," Transportation Secretary Anthony Foxx said in announcing the fine. "The last thing families and passengers should have to worry about at such a stressful time is how to get information from their carrier."
Spokesmen for Asiana didn't immediately respond to a request for comment.
For approximately one day following the crash, Asiana failed to widely publicize any telephone number for family members of those onboard, and the number available was a reservations line, according to the department.
The reservations line did not include a separate menu option for calls related to the crash and callers were required to navigate through cumbersome automated menus before being connected to an Asiana employee, according to the department.
Asiana also lacked translators and personnel trained in crash response, the transportation department found.
In the late 1990s, after airlines were roundly criticized for ignoring desperate requests for information after crashes, Congress required carriers to dedicate significant attention to families of passengers.
Last fall, The Associated Press reviewed plans filed by two dozen foreign airlines and found cases in which carriers had not updated their family assistance plans as required.
Since AP's story, several airlines have updated family assistance plans and filed new paperwork with the Department of Transportation. Among them is Asiana's bigger rival, Korean Air.
02-25-2014, 05:00 PM
#874
Line Holder
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Posts: 79
It is RARE you will ever hear me say this:
High-5 to the government
What amazes me is that there was no "partnership" between United and Asiana.
Surely United would have had ALL in place.
This should be part of an airline alliance.
High-5 to the government
What amazes me is that there was no "partnership" between United and Asiana.
Surely United would have had ALL in place.
This should be part of an airline alliance.
02-25-2014, 07:22 PM
#875
Runs with scissors
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Going to hell in a bucket, but enjoying the ride .
Posts: 7,722
It's their Culture, they don't like to speak of bad things:
"Spokesmen for Asiana didn't immediately respond to a request for comment.
For approximately one day following the crash, Asiana failed to widely publicize any telephone number for family members of those onboard, and the number available was a reservations line, according to the department.
The reservations line did not include a separate menu option for calls related to the crash and callers were required to navigate through cumbersome automated menus before being connected to an Asiana employee, according to the department.
Asiana also lacked translators and personnel trained in crash response, the transportation department found."
Their culture is in part what caused the accident in the first place, the new LCA in the right seat probably didn't want to speak up and point out that the new Capt. in the left seat was high and hot, then low and slow.
Dishonor?
No, Save Face!
"Spokesmen for Asiana didn't immediately respond to a request for comment.
For approximately one day following the crash, Asiana failed to widely publicize any telephone number for family members of those onboard, and the number available was a reservations line, according to the department.
The reservations line did not include a separate menu option for calls related to the crash and callers were required to navigate through cumbersome automated menus before being connected to an Asiana employee, according to the department.
Asiana also lacked translators and personnel trained in crash response, the transportation department found."
Their culture is in part what caused the accident in the first place, the new LCA in the right seat probably didn't want to speak up and point out that the new Capt. in the left seat was high and hot, then low and slow.
Dishonor?
No, Save Face!
02-26-2014, 06:13 AM
#876
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2009
Position: Airbus 319/320 Captain
Posts: 880
Originally Posted by Timbo
It's their Culture, they don't like to speak of bad things:
"Spokesmen for Asiana didn't immediately respond to a request for comment.
For approximately one day following the crash, Asiana failed to widely publicize any telephone number for family members of those onboard, and the number available was a reservations line, according to the department.
The reservations line did not include a separate menu option for calls related to the crash and callers were required to navigate through cumbersome automated menus before being connected to an Asiana employee, according to the department.
Asiana also lacked translators and personnel trained in crash response, the transportation department found."
Their culture is in part what caused the accident in the first place, the new LCA in the right seat probably didn't want to speak up and point out that the new Capt. in the left seat was high and hot, then low and slow.
Dishonor?
No, Save Face!
"Spokesmen for Asiana didn't immediately respond to a request for comment.
For approximately one day following the crash, Asiana failed to widely publicize any telephone number for family members of those onboard, and the number available was a reservations line, according to the department.
The reservations line did not include a separate menu option for calls related to the crash and callers were required to navigate through cumbersome automated menus before being connected to an Asiana employee, according to the department.
Asiana also lacked translators and personnel trained in crash response, the transportation department found."
Their culture is in part what caused the accident in the first place, the new LCA in the right seat probably didn't want to speak up and point out that the new Capt. in the left seat was high and hot, then low and slow.
Dishonor?
No, Save Face!
02-26-2014, 03:27 PM
#878
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2009
Position: Airbus 319/320 Captain
Posts: 880
Originally Posted by FDXLAG
There you go bringing up obamacare.
03-31-2014, 02:43 PM
#879
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,716
03-31-2014, 07:21 PM
#880
Runs with scissors
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Going to hell in a bucket, but enjoying the ride .
Posts: 7,722
I saw a news story today that said Asiana is now blaming Boeing for the accident, because the airplane didn't -automatically- protect the speed.
I think it would have, had the pilots been properly operating the airplane...
http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?sec...sco&id=9486191
I think it would have, had the pilots been properly operating the airplane...
http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?sec...sco&id=9486191
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