Challenger Crash Aspen
 

A challenger has just crashed at Aspen. Have a buddy who watched it happen. Nothing on the news yet. Doesn't look good. Prayers for the families.

Wow, upside down.

KASE 051953Z 31016G30KT 7SM HZ BKN037 OVC048 M12/M20 A3008 RMK AO2 PK WND 32030/1950 SNB40E50 SLP248 P0000 T11221200 $
KASE 051958Z 0520/0618 31015G30KT P6SM VCSH BKN040 OVC050
FM052100 34012KT P6SM BKN040 OVC060
FM060300 21006KT P6SM FEW050 SCT070
FM060900 19010KT P6SM SCT100

Looks a bit windy there.

here's some more info

Aircraft Accident at Aspen (KASE) - N115WF Canadair Challenger ? FlightAware

Very interesting how it came to a stop, upside down with at least one wing still attached. Obvious fire damage. Looks like maybe the TR's were deployed already. Wow, it will be interesting to see what happened.

But almost right down the runway...

My buddy said the plane landed long with a gusty tailwind, bounced, lost control, and then flipped over.

I think they were landing on 15

http://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/f.../AAB0203_1.jpg

http://www.boldmethod.com/images/blo...ckr-Frants.jpg


Airport Info

Weather:

Wind between 10-18mph, clouds lowering from 4600ft to 3700ft, visibility lowering from 9mi to 7mi in haze, temperature 12F/-11C. Winds gusting to 30 knots. Vicinity showers.

Aircraft:

N115WF
Airframe: 1994 CL-600-2B16
Engines: CF34 SERIES

Registered Owner:

BANK OF UTAH TRUSTEE
200 E SOUTH TEMPLE STE 210

I would believe that if they attempted to land with almost a direct tailwind of 16 G 30.

RIP to the one person and hopefully a speedy recovery for the rest.

maybe a hold over Dove Creek VOR then some circling/etc near Aspen prior to landing ?

N115WF ? FlightAware

From LiveATC recordings, hearing windshear reports of -10/+20kts on short final to Rwy 15 on first approach, and the accident aircraft declared a missed approach, stating 33kts tailwind. On second approach, tower called winds 320@16, pk gust 25kts (tailwind).

do you have a link to that audio ?

That within limitation s for that A/C.?....

AFM limit is 10 it's on the tail, like most planes.

GF

went missed due to 33 knots tailwind at one point

10 minute mark N115WF shows up on audio

flying the LOC 15 approach

http://archive-server.liveatc.net/ka...2014-1900Z.mp3

You are correct the limit is 10 knots on the tail. The TR's on this airplane are also extremely effective. I fear i may know who it is so prayers to that person. This airplane is sticky on a go around especially with a v2 cut. I am typed on the 601.

may be based at MMTO Toluca, FYI

Please tell me your kidding......toluca mexico???

[QUOTE=ClarenceOver;1552967]Please tell me your kidding......toluca mexico???[/QUOTE

He's not kidding. Flight originally came in from there with a stop in Tuscon, then to Aspen. Sorry if you know them. Hoping for the best.

Yes i knew them. I right seated for the guy at simuflite. Very unfortunate. :(

Unfortunate that a life was lost. Aircraft are designed to land into the wind for a reason. 320@16-25 is enough to come back another day. Sad that somebody just had to get there.

I'm truly sorry, my condolences.

After looking at the photos, it's incredible that anyone survived. I do wonder why the airport was even landing on 15 with the winds being what they were and why the crew would accept 15, unless they requested it.

If my memory serves me correct, I think 15 is the only landing direction with an approach. Been years since I have been there. Shouldn't have even been attempted.

They were shooting the LOC/DME-E. It's a circling approach so why they would choose to land 15 is beyond me, especially a second time. Seems this could have very easily been avoided.

I don't either, WX was above circling mins. Who knows!

Even if wx was above circling minimums, I still wouldn't circle to 33 at that airport. Just go to another airport. Very unfortunate.

Anyone contemplating circling to 33 needs to look at the video again. The ridges near the town, where you will be circling with a strong tailwind pushing you toward the terrain is all obscured by cloud. Just because the METAR has the min weather doesn't mean circling is possible or advisable.

Our SOP is 33, winds permitting or divert.

GF

I agree, I just looked at the plate and operating by the book by diverting and trying another day is much better than dying a cowboy today! Condolences to the families. Tailwinds to the FO.

That all makes sense. I've never been there before.

yes, Toluca. SAE FBO I believe it spends a lot of time at

another site is reporting crew as

Capt/PIC: Moisés Arturo Carranza Brabata - reported as deceased
FO/SIC: Sergio Emilio Carranza Brabata (related to Capt?)
Pax: Miguel Ángel Enríquez

** all unverified/nothing official per FAA/NTSB/etc

I just read it was the FO who perished. Can't ever trust media to get anything right anyway. Sad regardless who it is.

Honestly this is just sad.....God speed to those who didn't make it.

The copilot is the one who perished, confirmed. Sad no matter who it was.

Having been in there many times, I have seen some airplanes circle into 33, including a G5. However, I can tell you that you better be very familiar with every undulation of the terrain around there, and even then, the weather needs to be very VFR. The reason it's a circling approach is because of the descent rate required (greater than 400 ft/nm to from the FAF to the pavement). That doesn't preclude you from landing straight in, it's just the TERPS criteria. At my previous operator, we couldn't continue the approach past the FAF unless we had the field in sight due to the lack of performance in case of a missed approach.
Also, in order to depart on 15, you are supposed to sign a waiver and have it on file with the tower.

I really am surprised they would have shot the second approach with a 33kn tailwind... I don't know many guys who would try that in a large jet rated to that. RIP to the crew.

I believe the divert airport would be Rifle. Any info on weather there ?

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c2...ps55f626a9.jpg

From con-pilot over at PPRUNE

What a tragedy.

I'm here in Aspen now. Flew in several days ago. I was on the gondola to the mountaintop restaurant and back yesterday when this happened. Ridiculous winds & a really scary ride.
I have circled and landed jets to the north here when the surface winds have exceeded our 10 knot limits, but ONLY when the weather was VFR w/o clouds, a steady wind & absent wind shear.

A shame:(

It's amazing how people keep trying to make tailwind conditions work. Is it the complacency one gets from having TRs and being able to deal with the same amount as an X-wind with no problems? It just blows my mind...