Au contraire. It’s why I, like many others, am not even APPLYING for the job. I’m glad you found it an “OK place to make a living with an OK quality of life,” but the marketplace has changed. A guy with 1500 hrs TT can make $50 an hour as a newbie at regionals today, with a signing bonus, and yes, have housing during training and then have better working rules afterwards. That’s TODAYS reality. And Sunny either needs to adjust to it, or you are going to wind up with right seats populated by guys/gals with a grand total of 1500 hrs, mostly CFI time in Cessna 152s with 25 hours in light twins. Good luck with that.

Because SY has only had MSP for a domicile since the beginning, paying for hotels during training just wasn’t going to be a priority IMO. Most people that go there wouldn’t go there for the money, they’d go for the MSP domicile and the ok long term pay.

I’m not sure what all of the frustration is about. If there are better offers, go take them. Regionals are paying hiring bonuses but after the first year it sucks. At SY, the first year pay blows but after that it’s ok. Sure it’s way below industry standard for a 737 operator but if you really want to fly the kind of trips they fly and have MSP for a domicile then maybe it could work for you. Otherwise go somewhere else! The market is still hot.

For the vast majority of pilots SY is a no go. Perhaps their management will have a crisis trying to recruit and they’ll eventually have to raise the bar. Until then I wouldn’t expect existing SY pilots to make first year pay a priority because attracting applicants only makes it harder for them to justify better work rules and compensation during contract negotiations.

My guess is that if things continue as is, SY will have flocks of FO’s with relatively fresh 737 type ratings leaving for more stable, higher paying airlines. Attrition has slowed temporarily there but IMO unless something changes for the better in a significant way, attrition will go right back up.

Hear that everybody!? ExCargoDog isn’t going to apply!!! Might as well shut the airline down. His expertise will be sorely missed.

He's not the only one. I think I'd be a good fit and have a ton of respect for the Sunny pilot group.

I actually think the first year pay was a decent rate for the time the contract was signed even if it's fell behind the times now. Hoping for good things for you guys all around in the new contract.

But it's a 40k/year pay cut from my regional captain job. It's at least year 3 FO to break even. I want out of my current gig and MSP is a huge draw for me but the math just literally doesn't work for year one. I don't mind some pay cut but I don't want to have to sell my house...

You don't work there then stop acting like the current guys are throwing all the new hires under the bus. You don't have a clue. It sounds like you want to work there but don't because of the pay.... Delta's hiring and they also have a MSP base....

Nobody there really cares. Do what you think is best for you. There are 300 pilots at Sun Country now that are ready to fight for a new contract.

Mark my word when we get our new contact you will need similar credentials to get hired here as you would to get hired at any of the big dogs.

Your current contract was voted in with an 87% yes vote in 2015. Oddly, your MEC chairman called it a victory that brings you economic respectability amongst your peers.
Understanding that, Apollo is going to give you an upgrade from 40% below industry average to 35% below industry average and you will like it.
Too bad because you seem like a good pilot group. The only thing lacking is a little self worth.

I agree. I’m sure the next contract will be close to industry average when it happens, but like we sit currently we will be well far back in a couple years. This airline has all the potential in the world we just never seem to get ownership to throw in all the marbles to make it one.

I'm sure there will be rotten tomatoes for saying this, but that probably will become the reality. Regionals are taking in the dregs of experience right now, what keeps SY from stooping to that level? Some of the low experience youngins are very sharp and will probably do fine. I was that guy when I got into 121 and things went great for me. As it were, my tailwheel, aerobatics, and crop dusting experience didn't help me out much, but my ability to study and learn did.

Is there something particular about SY that makes it so much harder than a regional? If not, what keeps management from keeping pay low as long as it is still possible to hire people and get them training and qualified? Honest questions.