SWA to go at it alone
 

Per today’s 8-k filing, Southwest has decided not to participate in the federal secured loan program based on its current liquidity
and belief that it can secure additional financing at favorable terms.

Time to break from the pack!

Sounds like a good move to me!

Indeed this should be a good sign. So just to be clear, we took the payroll grants but not the loans of the Cares Act. Is that correct?

Yeah, that’s my understanding. No reason not to take the handout!

We already took the handouts. They were called grants. No airline has taken the loan side of cares act, yet.

ok dumb question but if Payroll Support Program is extended past Sept-30, is SWA going to accept it / participate ?

One more blow to PSP extension. SWA benefits from the industry carnage if there’s no extension.

Yes. Gary Kelly helped write the Cares Act, and he is actively lobbying for Cares 2. Im guessing the airlines are confident that
Cares 2 will pass since it has support in Congress.

^^^^^^
Yes. This exactly.

I actually read my company email, and look at the Ask Gary news instead of making things up.

Times a wasting.

Sure is. We announced additional schedule cuts today.

It does? You mean the House?

I have seen zero, nada, zip, about the "airline stimulus" "payroll support" etc stuff lately.

Zero

Yeah me either. They managed to find 16 senators to go along with it, and the President expressed support shortly before the My Pillow guy talked him up on Oleander supplements...

Since then nothing.


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yeah, it is either "no news is good news" or

"the calm before the storm"

The carnage that is going to come from the big 3 is going to float our ship. Just watch.

Moron

you’re here by dumb luck. Nothing else.

Just like the rest of us.

He isn't wrong.

Nor is Roff.

As a Nation we are well past the era of accountability...that's so 1950s

What happened to Ford, GM, and Chrysler...none of them were allowed to fail during the last financial crisis...what's different this time that makes you think any company will be allowed to fail?

Companies will be allowed to fail. These are manufacturers that you mention, not service providers. The same way Boeing will most likely be saved. Airlines come and go, too many examples to list them all...

GM was the only one in your example that was not allowed to fail . That is one out of 3 ( sound familiar)?

I do not think the current administration, would do the same .

GM: Ch.11 in 2009. Filed after there request to merge with Ford was declined by Ford.

Chrysler: Ch.11 in 2009

Ford: almost filed but avoided it. some believe better management and a better product line (F150 pickups v PT Cruisers and Buick Lacrosses) helped them narrowly avoid Ch 11.

Im dusting off memories but I think Ford also had fortunately practiced a contrasting debt and liquidity model prior to the crisis which helped when things went bad?

Possibly so. Important to remember is the "financial crisis" was impacting everybody, both the economy, and the stock market. Today, the stock market is going thru the roof. The economy is hurting, yes.

Also, the above companies filed, or came close to filing, Ch.11 The bailout was approved by Bush in December 2008 via Executive Action, after the Senate shot it down. It required "drastic changes" internally at the companies as part of the package.

3-6 months later GM and Chrysler filed Ch.11

It JUST DOESN’T MATTER.

Southwest and the other single-type fleet airlines have a far superior model for this situation, much less dependent on business and international flying and much less affected by training churn if displacements and furloughs become necessary. And much less dependent on regional feed which will be hit badly next year by scope limitations based on this years reduced parent major blockhours.

Yes, a rising tide lifts all boats and an ebbing tide lowers them all too, but in this case the different models don’t allow that tide to affect them all EQUALLY.

You don’t have to wish ill on the employees of other carriers to acknowledge that some business models are going to do better than others in the new environment.

Or that it is in the nature of management - indeed, part of their due diligence to stockholders - to take advantage of opportunities to gain market share:



Airlines have been deregulated. They ain’t a public utility any more. And Capitalism is always a little cutthroat.

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It’s gonna happen.

These words will very likely be proven true over time. Its not like any vacuum created by airlines who won’t make it won’t be gladly filled by those who will.

If history shows anything it is that absolutely everything flows and nothing stays the same.

You still live in a glass house. All the glee of potential demise of other airlines is premature, if not in not in bad taste. Carry on corn dog warriors.

p.s. I'll be the one slowing to final approach speed before the outer marker just to make you annoyed.

I hope that wasn’t for me. I hope and pray every last of our brothers and sisters keep their jobs. But I do think that you will see a lot of airlines having to rethink their business model going forward to survive and grow from there.

Your name says it all. Slow all you want son. And nobody wants demise of other airlines as we all have friends at multiple carriers. I fully expect us to shrink and furlough come 2021. Don't be so naive and think talking our management's business strategy is hoping for demise elsewhere.

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I’ll take you up on that bet. We’ve probably seen the worst and we aren’t furloughing. Once a vaccine approval is even announced, people will start acting differently and more confident. The only thing holding people back is the lack of jobs (which is big, don’t get me wrong), but companies will start hiring again soon. The 3 legacies have way more vulnerabilities.

Oh noez, more block time!!!11

This White Knight **** is getting old. No one wants to see our friends on the streets, but at the same time, if I had to choose an airline to be the one left standing, it's going to be the one writing my checks. I'm not sure how that makes me or anyone else full of "glee of potential demise of other airlines". Maybe spend less time being the feelings police and more time shortening that approach briefing.

[QUOTE=Jaded N Cynical;3113140]You still live in a glass house. All the glee of potential demise of other airlines is premature, if not in not in bad taste. Carry on corn dog warriors.

p.s. I'll be the one slowing to final approach speed before the outer marker just to make you annoyed.[/QUOTE]


Now that’s funny , who do you think you are hurting more as you **** away more of your company’s money ?

SWA to go at it alone
 

I personally don't consider the cost to the company when I'm slowing and configuring for a stabilized approach. But that's just me.

He isn't wrong. WAY too many of our pilots lack even a modicum of empathy towards our fellow aviators. Not even a notion of "but for the grace of god go I". They live in this Fantasyland of "it can never happen here", and "full pay till the last day."

"Keep Dean" is just a slogan on a bag tag but not a call to action for far too many of our pilots.

They are the one-airline wonders who have worked here and no place else. They've never endured furloughs or bankruptcies and are rather impressed with their prescient choice of airline. Not everyone thinks this way - but a vocal minority.

I don't want to lose my job either. I'm not so arrogant as to believe it can't happen here.


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I don't think we'll furlough. This whole thing is gonna be over on November 4 or soon thereafter. It'll be either via a vaccine, or some new study that will show that our numbers were grossly overinflated and we counted people dying *with* and *with presumptive* COVID in the same group as dying *of* COVID, and the former will be far, far higher than the latter thereby lowering our death numbers much lower than they are.

In any case, the virus is gonna have to run its course, and I'm willing to bet that our collective reaction will be studied as one of the largest human blunders and "WTF were we thinking" periods in modern history.

As for Southwest, should the worst happen, I do see them offering another round of VSP's and ExTO's before resorting to furloughs.

You should be more worried about United's ability to survive rather than some lame attempt to "annoy" Southwest on final.

Agree.

Scientists: Saving face, causing the initial (and arguably justifiable) overreaction to perpetuate ad nauseum
Medical Professionals: At 39K per COVID ICU (CARES Act)...ample incentive to over-represent
Media: Hourly death counts propagating fear, driving ad sales (click bait) through the roof. Ridiculing/cancelling dissenters
Entertainment industry: Mindless condescension/ self-promotion, demanding we stay home/stay safe...from their home gyms
Social Media: Punishing/cancelling/boycotting those failing to fall in line.
Government: Sending fat checks to keep people home, making more than if they were working.
Politicians: All the above, while never letting a crisis go to waste.

Amazing lack of self awareness

In retrospect, it was naïve to believe the common good would take precedence, that wise practices such as protecting the vulnerable would replace ruinous lockdowns and school closures. I failed to recognize how many stood to benefit.

In the end, I believe the initial death count estimates will be exceeded because of Covid,
not the virus, but the Agenda-driven measures taken.

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