Well why don't you call or e mail then because the last 3 times I've called the 3 answers I have gotten are the same 3 things I mentioned prior (not exact phraseology about the twiddling of the thumbs but you get the idea). I wouldn't say my talking points are weak I am just stating facts that need to be taken into consideration so we can wake up out of fantasy land. The company has ZERO incentive to move on anything we ask, that is just a fact, no one wants to hear that but its true. If stating pure facts make me a "troll" to make you feel better than fine by me, but I am a member of this pilot group, one of us, I am just looking at the stone cold numbers instead of "feelings" and "what we deserve", because the company could give a crap about either no matter how much we complain and do phone polls and pickets.

At least your getting paid for this crap. I'm not. Your ideas that we have nothing gain and no leverage mean that your pretty small, or a troll... I'm tired and going to make this my last post to you, this group will burn this place to the ground before we take a bs contract. You can manage expectations and speak all you want, but your gonna get demoted in your job. This one you won't win. Lawyers and interns think they are really super smart. And, they are, sometimes. In this one, you will lose. If you think this campaign will make you the next marty, your wrong. Go find another way to get divorced... Love ya! Smiles me kisses! [emoji10][emoji10][emoji10]

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Alright mr troll, I'm going to bite here and try to evaluate your position. Tell me oh wise one.... what should we be doing?! I really want to hear what your master plan would be?!

I'm not going to start debating specifics when we both know management reads these boards. My "master plan" doesn't matter since I am not in the MEC, however I am allowed to criticize and bring us down to Earth a bit here. But I can tell you it wouldn't be to conduct a phone poll and then sit around for the next X number of years hoping something magical will happen. Especially when we have zero leverage and are no longer in mediation. With a screen name like "popachubby" I think if anyone is the troll here its you. You guys are sure obsessed with the name troll.

He doesn't answer me, but calls in to question your reason for being here. I know poppa and he ain't the troll here. Lincoln just said he is trying to bring us down to earth. Did you forget we are all on the same boards? I'm done giving you the benefit of the doubt. Your a horrible troll. Your insights aren't even dividing us. You might even be uniting us. I would imagine your bosses might be ****ed about that one. It's funny, but all you guys have dreams of going out on your own and doing some union busting. You might have a hard time with this one. Maybe family law would be more your speed. You know, last will and testament and such. It's a good living and you really don't need wits... Sounds great for you. Once you set it up, post here, because we will all have estates to be processed. I promise we will be nice!

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Please stop responding to this DB. He can talk to himself.

I'm just saying...had Spirit pilots taken an 3 year JetBlue/Allegiant type contract in Aug of 15, you'd be negotiating for an 10%-25% raise right now instead of for an 40%-60% raise, at the same time with possibly 1 or 2 hundred grand more in your pockets for the years past. And a few hundred grand more if the company stalls vs your current situation.

I'd think its a heck of a lot easier negotiating for an 20% raise than a 60% raise.

My questions is, are you really in a better position now than you would be had you taken a 3 year deal back in 2015?

Realistically, I think your group will be lucky to get a deal by 2020, and the type of deal is yet to be seen. I also think your MEC and NC made a gross miscalculation in tactics that's brought you to this point. It's all water under the bridge now, too much pride involved now to take a non-legacy type deal (even though you may not get it anyhow). Might as well promote unity.

This is just my casual observation.

Sadly, I agree. And apparently the NMB does too.

Could be a tribute to to blues singer/guitarist of the same name. You a blues fan, Poppachubby?

There was no deal to take in august of 2015.

Union buster #1
Feng

Would there of been if your union took a different stance than the hardliner one you promote?

The reason your children's college savings fund isn't complete by now:
Qotsaautopilot

Man, Ford and Harrison must be scraping the bottom of the barrel these days if this is the level of trolling they can accomplish.

Hey Feng, how is the view from that cubicle?

You know, everyone has left the table. There are no more negotiations for the forseeable future. I understand the need to dig up point at imaginary enemies even though there aren't any. Not a thing I said influenced or will influence anyone's position. It has no effect what so ever on your negotiations. The position you're in today has nothing to do with me and ai sympathize with the need to point fingers. Point away if it makes you feel better about your predicament.

Good luck!

The company will come crawling back to the negotiating table. We have all the power. Just look at the stock price. They need this deal done.

I know that Bendo cannot stand pilots getting paid while sitting at home. Heard it from his own mouth. So, lets enjoy our transition drop, reserve drop, inability to reassign, unrealistic reserve grid and line bidding for the holiday season. Spending time with family and friends is way more important that giving up work rules for a quick bump in pay.

A second and third offer is coming in fact they are probably already drafted. Be patient everyone, especially you Feng. Unbunch your panties.

https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-financial-executives-networking-group

For all the Trump supporters out there.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_593efff1e4b0b13f2c6d5df5/amp

Great source! OMG Left wing Huffington Post.

[QUOTE=Super EZ E;2446104]Great source! OMG Left wing Huffington Post.[/QUOTE

http://www.forbes.com/sites/danielfisher/2016/11/16/judge-permanently-blocks-persuader-rule-requiring-firms-to-disclose-labor-advice/#7c51d12c7b4a

[QUOTE=hayimcow;2446107]Sorry EZ, you'll have to copy and paste, couldn't get the link to work.

Ahhh yes........as always......you make perfect sense.......

No, honestly.... Not familiar. Blues is ok yet more of a headbanger! Givin the dog a bone comes to mind!

It's still true.

And FENG is identified! Nice...

It's the same 5-10 of you dingbats that run this site....
Hundreds of us sit back, read your ridiculous posts, and laugh.

It's slightly entertaining, but that's about all..

Go play with your kids, go fishing, do something fun....

STOP FEEDING THE TROLLS....

😘

It was December of 2015 but you are correct in concept. My life for the last two years would have been significantly better, I would have more money in the bank, and more crap paid off now had we taken a deal. Unfortunately our MEC is sitting on an anthill looking up at the Goliath's of the industry demanding the rockstar life they're living. I want Delta 777 rates to but we're not going to get it at Spirit.

LTD isn't negotiable, scope costs the company nothing, and we know PBS is coming. Come of the ask for rules we can live with and let's all enjoy a $100k pay raise and start gearing up for the next fight in five years or working on our resumes for a better job while at least making a livable wage.

$100k now is far better than $125k in three years. Time value, and we're losing quickly.

*$TFUP dude.

Relax everybody,.. obviously this guy is joking. Even a troll would not try to sell us that delusional POS that the company tried to slide in front of us back in Dec 2015.

Just stop. These posts do not reflect the pilot group.

Attachment 3348

And NC!

Whats funny is we would be stuck with that POS deal they offered us in 2015 all the way to 2025. Dont be so short-sighted

It’s all kind of a gamble isn’t it? You’re really just playing the odds and hoping it’d go in your favor. Only time will tell.

People used to joke about “contract 2020.” Thats only about 2 years away now. That time will be gone in a flash. It’ll be 2 years away from 2022 in no time.

I mean even in your example, what’s worse?

1. Sign the sizable raise back in December of 2015, and get stuck with that “POS” until 2025 to presumably get a industry standard/leading contract then.

2. Stuck with the current even worse POS from 2015 to 2022, in which time presumably you’ll get a legacy standard contract by getting an 80% raise on DOS.

One can argue that shooting for the moon is short sighted and incremental climb to industry parity is actually playing the long game.

It’ll be real interesting to see how this shakes out.

You're right. We're better off now with our 2010 contract.:rolleyes: If we had accepted the company offer my rate right now would be $98/hour with a 1% DC for an effective rate of $98.98 instead of the current $77.73. That would be 27.5% more than I am currently making. The proposed current rate, which has been tabled, for me would be $112.17 with a 11% DC (IIRC) for an effective rate of $124.50. A 'raise' of 26% over the proposed two years ago. These type of rate increases in increments might be a little more tolerable than the 48% raises we've demanded, and have been granted, with restrictions by the company and the NMB.

Our negotiators are nice guys but we've been outsmarted, outplayed, and outmaneuvered every step of the way. We hiked up the contract skirt in 2015 showing our 'strength'. Where's our quid? We demanded profit sharing out of our pockets to pay for everyone else. We got our MEC personally named in the TRO. Has anyone asked what happens when they aren't ALPA office holders yet still named in a TRO? We voted in a strike authorization that will never happen and failed to publicly capitalize on this false threat. I have an 'I VOTED' bag tag that maybe two people in the terminal will even notice much less be aware of what the reference is. But hey, it's red. Scary. The company has professional negotiators and lawyers and we have pilots running the show. It was a systemic failure every step of the way.

So, we can either keep pointing at AA, DAL, UAL, and WN screaming for their rates (they probably have more airplanes in MX than we have flying the line, NEO's excluded) whose acceptance depends on this company not being able to put bodies in the seats with minimal attrition or come off the rates a bit for LTD, scope, and PBS with decent rules for more money NOW.

We don't pay our FA's jack. We don't pay our MX jack. We don't pay our HR jack. We don't pay our DX jack. We contract below the wing and don't pay them jack. But yes, we, WE are going to be the lone labor group with an industry standard rate and work rule package. I wish we would, I really, really do. But at some point you have to stop clicking your ruby red heels and start dealing with reality.

You’re debating with someone who either A. Wants to make as much as possible before they move on to their next airline or B. Someone with few years left till retirement and they’d rather swallow the pathetic compensation offered up by management like a _____. <— Fill in the blank. Best not to debate with the stupid & spineless.... Added another to my ignore list.

Sounds like someone's got a class date elsewhere and would like to collect a "retro" check before they punch out. My expectations will not be managed down and trying to do it here is exactly what spirit wants.

I'm not going to add Macjet to the union buster tally because I think he is an actual union brother that clearly knows how to do math and probably took an intro to finance with the time value of money talk. I think he's a bit short sighted and misguided. Don't let spirit management break you which is what they are trying to do and don't let how spirit handles the other work groups determine how you value yourself as a professional. You are a professional. Now act like you've been here before. If you came from a regional or 36th street cargo, or crappy 135, check that mindset at the door. This is a different ball game. You may not think so but we are winning. I think Allegiant is hiring if you don't think so. Just think about how much more money you would have had you gone two years ago. Don't wait another day! Go now!

............

LOL please explain that one.

When CommutAir looks more attractive to a 1500 hr CFI than Spirit does, the writing is on the wall.

Don't feed the trolls

Guess that means that you can’t. Understood.