Whats funny is we would be stuck with that POS deal they offered us in 2015 all the way to 2025. Dont be so short-sighted

It’s all kind of a gamble isn’t it? You’re really just playing the odds and hoping it’d go in your favor. Only time will tell.

People used to joke about “contract 2020.” Thats only about 2 years away now. That time will be gone in a flash. It’ll be 2 years away from 2022 in no time.

I mean even in your example, what’s worse?

1. Sign the sizable raise back in December of 2015, and get stuck with that “POS” until 2025 to presumably get a industry standard/leading contract then.

2. Stuck with the current even worse POS from 2015 to 2022, in which time presumably you’ll get a legacy standard contract by getting an 80% raise on DOS.

One can argue that shooting for the moon is short sighted and incremental climb to industry parity is actually playing the long game.

It’ll be real interesting to see how this shakes out.

You're right. We're better off now with our 2010 contract.:rolleyes: If we had accepted the company offer my rate right now would be $98/hour with a 1% DC for an effective rate of $98.98 instead of the current $77.73. That would be 27.5% more than I am currently making. The proposed current rate, which has been tabled, for me would be $112.17 with a 11% DC (IIRC) for an effective rate of $124.50. A 'raise' of 26% over the proposed two years ago. These type of rate increases in increments might be a little more tolerable than the 48% raises we've demanded, and have been granted, with restrictions by the company and the NMB.

Our negotiators are nice guys but we've been outsmarted, outplayed, and outmaneuvered every step of the way. We hiked up the contract skirt in 2015 showing our 'strength'. Where's our quid? We demanded profit sharing out of our pockets to pay for everyone else. We got our MEC personally named in the TRO. Has anyone asked what happens when they aren't ALPA office holders yet still named in a TRO? We voted in a strike authorization that will never happen and failed to publicly capitalize on this false threat. I have an 'I VOTED' bag tag that maybe two people in the terminal will even notice much less be aware of what the reference is. But hey, it's red. Scary. The company has professional negotiators and lawyers and we have pilots running the show. It was a systemic failure every step of the way.

So, we can either keep pointing at AA, DAL, UAL, and WN screaming for their rates (they probably have more airplanes in MX than we have flying the line, NEO's excluded) whose acceptance depends on this company not being able to put bodies in the seats with minimal attrition or come off the rates a bit for LTD, scope, and PBS with decent rules for more money NOW.

We don't pay our FA's jack. We don't pay our MX jack. We don't pay our HR jack. We don't pay our DX jack. We contract below the wing and don't pay them jack. But yes, we, WE are going to be the lone labor group with an industry standard rate and work rule package. I wish we would, I really, really do. But at some point you have to stop clicking your ruby red heels and start dealing with reality.

You’re debating with someone who either A. Wants to make as much as possible before they move on to their next airline or B. Someone with few years left till retirement and they’d rather swallow the pathetic compensation offered up by management like a _____. <— Fill in the blank. Best not to debate with the stupid & spineless.... Added another to my ignore list.

Sounds like someone's got a class date elsewhere and would like to collect a "retro" check before they punch out. My expectations will not be managed down and trying to do it here is exactly what spirit wants.

I'm not going to add Macjet to the union buster tally because I think he is an actual union brother that clearly knows how to do math and probably took an intro to finance with the time value of money talk. I think he's a bit short sighted and misguided. Don't let spirit management break you which is what they are trying to do and don't let how spirit handles the other work groups determine how you value yourself as a professional. You are a professional. Now act like you've been here before. If you came from a regional or 36th street cargo, or crappy 135, check that mindset at the door. This is a different ball game. You may not think so but we are winning. I think Allegiant is hiring if you don't think so. Just think about how much more money you would have had you gone two years ago. Don't wait another day! Go now!

............

LOL please explain that one.

When CommutAir looks more attractive to a 1500 hr CFI than Spirit does, the writing is on the wall.

Don't feed the trolls

Guess that means that you can’t. Understood.