He says he has 18 years left so most of that will be spent on the SWA FO scale vs Spirit CA scale. I can see how he got his numbers.

I’ve noticed a lot of people like to use profit sharing and a slightly higher retirement DC in factors of career earnings, retirement especially that will grow with interest. However I never see people mention the interest lost for the lesser wages taken when making the switch from the start.

If he makes $100k less year one at SWA vs Spirit, what is that $100k worth over the course of 18 years for retirement? If at 8% growth, that’s worth $400,000 in 18 years. Granted this is gross numbers and not net, but I’m sure you get my point. There’s is a huge opportunity cost in earning those first many years and it should be calculated when trying to compare apples and apples. And sadly there isn’t a QOL column on Excel to factor in going from line holder Ca to reserve FO at the bottom.

I’m glad he enjoys SWA and it seems he went in with his eyes wide open too, not the typical “I’ll make millions more at....”

I just did the numbers at min guarantee, 10 yr upgrade at SWA, upgrade in 3 more yrs at spirit (I'd been there already almost 2 years), plus 401k, over the 18 years I have remaining until age 65. With those assumptions, over the 18 remaining years Spirit income was almost $200k more than SWA, which comes close to about what I might expect from SWA profit sharing.

People say you can make quite a bit more than min guarantee at SWA and that's very true, but in my time at Spirit you could make quite a bit more than min flying extra and premium, so I think opportunities for extra flying and extra pay is similar at both places if you work the schedule with the same level of intensity.

So, that's why I'm saying what I'm saying. I did the math and over 18 yrs, starting from year 2 at Spirit already, the basic guarantee pay is very very close due to being 3-4 yrs from upgrade at Spirit and starting over again at SWA with a 10 yr upgrade. Obviously those numbers are significantly different depending on where you're sitting on the seniority list at spirit before jumping ship, and equally significantly different if the remaining time until mandatory retirement is longer. I was in that strange part of the salary/seniority/earnings curve where for me specifically, the higher long-term SWA pay wouldn't make up for the difference I'd see upgrade in just 3-4 yrs vs. another 10.

Before I jumped ship, most of the captains I flew with agreed that with the new contract anyone at Spirit who had already been there longer than 3-4 years might be better off staying due to all the usual reasons including scheduling QOL, historically relatively quick upgrade, salary, and flying new-ish airplanes with a good pilot group. I don't know how much the upgrade timeline has changed so I'm sure the considerations have changed somewhat since I left.

Spot on. Your point about lost compound interest on earnings early on in the game is also a player. Doing nearly back to back first-years put me on the wrong side of the cash flow equation for nearly 3 straight years and due to a variety of life events, resulted in expending about $80k that should have remained in long term investments or at least a down payment for my next house. Instead of going cash flow positive in my 3rd year after mil retirement, I'm barely breaking even. I'm not complaining since it's because of very deliberate choices on where to live and what optional expenses to accept (youth hockey is stupidly expensive), but I'd be 1-2 years ahead already on my kid's college fund by now if I'd stayed at Spirit. That's a cost I accepted when I switched companies and while I don't regret it, I think it's a reasonable thing to discuss because there are plenty of other people making the same calculations and trying to decide what is "best". If you're on your third wife or have kids just starting college, "best" may not be a reset to first year salary and a 10 year upgrade. On the flip side, a guy who already upgraded at Spirit but who is comparatively young might very well have enough years remaining to be willing to try something new because they'll be at it long enough for it to pay off.

Thats part of the reasoning that led me to give up widebody flying as a career goal. I just don't think I'll be doing this long enough for that path to give me the overall QOL I can get at a NB only company, even one where I'll never break into the top 30% seniority. Totally different story if I had 20-30 years remaining, but with 18ish left I couldn't see myself ever getting enough seniority to have much control of my schedule QOL. Maybe I gave it up too soon, but I did spend a lot of time thinking about it and I think I made the right choice for me and my family.

A thought - 2 of the happiest guys I went through class with were guys who will never upgrade. Too old, they'll be FOs until retirement. One probably couldn't upgrade even if mandatory retirement gets boosted to 70. Both felt blessed just to be there and they worked as hard as everyone else to get their type and get through IOE. Talking to those guys helped me gain some perspective and helped me define what "best" meant to me, just as much as chatting with an unusually young Spirit CA did. Very informative hearing their stories and ideas about what makes up a good flying career.

I think what a lot of people forget factor in Is not being able to fly to age 65. God willing hopefully that is the case but most people need to plan that age 60-62 is probably more likely. My father could only make it to 61 before he couldn’t fly anymore. Luckily he got the same advice and planned to retire at 60. So as everyone plans out there career and choices people shouldn’t plan on those last 5 years.

Year 3 pay. YTD 58k gross. 37k net

My SWA buddy on 2nd year is already at 75k gross. He averages 110 trips/ month. I average 80 credit same days off. Usually he gets more days off