Just to keep pace at the greater than 6% discount on overall pay scale we work under vs DAL would essentially equal Alaska's new rates. Anything less is concessionary imo. Working for a two year deal. Keep in mind, this merger is no guarantee and two years to amendable can and probably will turn into 3 or more years after that of negotiating. Im pretty wary of this focused plan burning us down the road, especially if the NC is not presently focused on matching or bettering Alaska's rates dos and +1 at a minimum, in the light of DAL's AIP. I am going to assume based on the q/a quote you provided means the powers that be are targeting a 2 to 2.5% lag of Alaska's rates, which would actually serve to further widen our pay gap vs DAL, in spite of our sizable casm advantage vs both DAL and Alaska. Focused or not, I would not be able to get behind that in this kind of labor environment. Things change, and 34% increases over 4 years is a significant change.

Delta is 34% over 7 years - they would object to phrasing it as 34 over 4 years. The 18% year 1 is designed to make up for the lack of raises since 2019. But other than that, I don’t disagree with what you said. We deserve better than JetBlue plus a little.

But we probably won’t get it right now, and the question every pilot will need to ask is, is it worth taking a little now, or rejecting it now on the hopes that management will be desperate enough to come back with a higher offer? Remembering that we haven’t even gotten to our amendable date yet, so we will not be getting any retro pay… it’s a big gamble.

The two years since amendable turning into three… will probably happen anyway. Unless management is determined to get something done, that seems to be par for the course for airline negotiations these days

We’ll see what happens later this week

Delta isn't loosing pilots to other airlines or hurting for applicants, Spirit is. The whole "would they come back to the table its a gamble" argument falls right into managements playbook. If they weren't wanting to play ball they wouldn't even be at the table since they don't even have to be right now. Industry standard, or they can continue to loose pilots at a record rate and underutilize aircraft. We owe it to ourself and our peers to vote on nothing less than industry standard.

It’s a gamble because you aren’t going to make any extra money from the time of rejection to the time of a new deal. The unknown is how long it takes to reach a new deal after rejection. Unlike delta, where it was fully known that they would be demanding significant retro, we aren’t in a position to make such a demand because we are still working within the timeframe of a previously agreed to contract.

For example, if your pay rate was slated to go from $200 to $240 in the first agreement, and we turn it down and 8 months later get $250, you missed out on a $40/hr raise for 8 months.

Again, it’ll be up to every pilot to determine what gambles are worth taking based on their own assessments (if we even get something to vote on)… but I do think it’s kind of a unique situation. It’s hard to say what would happen. I can’t say how I’d go one way or another until we actually see something to vote on - just commenting on what I assume the negotiating committee is thinking about based on their public comments

Then for those 8 months you demand full retro. You can continue to fall for management scare tactics and accept less than your peers but I refuse to be a defeatist discount pilot.

I can’t say how I’d vote one way or another till I get something put in front of me. Merely saying what I expect the negotiating committee is thinking about, based on their public comments about a “two-step process”

There will be 5 or 6 on here who will be hell bent on voting down anything, regardless of the merits of the proposal, based on irrational logic. Happened last time with "Delta+ or im a firm no," and it will happen again with ironically "Delta AIP+ or im a firm no."

Best suggestion is not to engage with these types, its pandoras box that you wish you wouldn't open. Like you said, we will see what/if we get something and listen to the proposals from the NC and MEC and vote accordingly.

Oh good now the troll is here. Get back to work office boy.

Prepare to be underwhelmed by the proposal, if one even comes on the 9th. I’d pay close attention to the AIP for Delta and Alaska. American and United will certainly follow suit. We deserve something close. Definitely more than B6 current numbers

This proposal won’t be the result of a fully negotiated CBA.

This is simply whether the pilot group is willing to sell relief on first year compensation to the company prior to negotiations officially starting.

Regardless how you vote, It can’t be overstated how important it is to understand the difference between these two before pilots go marching around the line blustering about how they didn’t offer us Delta +$1