After the TA Fails….Time to Clean House
 

I’ve called my 109 reps this week, it’s time for the NC to go. I am so sick and tired of the whole “Get em next time” mantra. We have been in last place for several contracts now. The B6 AK and DA TAs absolutely put ours to shame. Especially for the junior pilots on property. Year 12 isn’t bad, but for junior NK pilots be $40 below DA, $30 below JB, and $20 below AK at DOS is absolutely pathetic. Especially since JB and AK both got snap ups to Legacy Carriers. It’s time to clean house on the NC after this TA fails. They have lost all perspective and I’m shocked they are still trying to sell this Sh!t Sanwhich at the road shows. I just threw my Orange Lanyard away, our Legacy is last place. Can’t wait to vote No! Keep calling and putting pressure on your reps to get these guys to fire the NC, just like UA and AA just did.

Spirit doesn’t get a special deal on A320s, or Fuel, or Gates just because they are Spirit. It should be no different for us. They can do what they need to do to figure out how to pay for everything. That’s their job, ours is to move passengers safely from A to B. And our job, shouldn’t subsidize the operation and the low tier management team that runs it!

www.delta.com

Not last place. Forgot about allegiant and frontier, who are probably considered more of our “peers” than delta.

When Allegiant got their last TA, the MD80 rate was $228, $20 hire an hour than Delta. Look at Sun Country and the rates they just got. That’s my problem with this place, the majority of the pilots are so beat down they normalize losing.

Funny you say that, just got my CJO and waiting for a class date. Tough to leave the left seat, but after seeing what we just negotiated and how our negotiators are defending it, makes leaving that much easier.

congrats. Help us out with a no vote before you go

As an added bonus, you'll get to work with people like deltad!ckface2022. But at least you'll be getting paid.

That’s the plan, unlike the LEC 18 Rep who is going to be Voting Yes twice for this Sh!t TA on his way out the door to Delta.

Who is it? Initials only is cool

With a 12 month upgrade I’ll get to spend 1 year with Dick Heads and 28 more years flying with my favorite Captain. But yes, money is why we all do this job. Why make .70 cents on the Dollar flying A321s between DFW and ATL just because “Spirit will always be Spirit.” It’s time for the pilots here to sac up, vote no, and demand industry standard pay to do the same job every other pilot does.

The NC made it very clear that these are our peers. They even had the nerve to say we should tell our Delta buddies to step up their game since they’re taking a smaller percentage of the revenue pie than we are.

DW….FO Rep. I mean think about that, we already lost one of our Negotiating Committee members to United. Now we are losing a MEC member to Delta, all the while he is in the chats selling this crap TA like it’s the best deal ever.

There’s your sign!!

Can you blame him? He still thinks he’s a SAPA rep.
This is ALPA my man. Not student council.

Frontier here. Happy to claim last. I would say Allegiant is behind us for now. Who knows how long?

Agree with cleaning house. NC has become a comical joke around the internet/chat groups. As for the "LEC 18 Rep" he has gone into hiding since this news broke about him leaving. Pathetic, needs to step down TODAY! No Balls.

I’ll be honest. I want a new TA but I’m not certain about the “cleaning house” aspect. Eventually yes. That takes time and will delay a new proposal I’m sure. We need to shoot this down and bring the company back asap. We have their dice in a vice. I wish more pilots were aware of just how desperate they are.

Sadly 90% of the pilots in his bases, do not know this. I posted this 2 weeks ago but post got deleted. Maybe do the same in the DFW chat to make our pilots who are staying here, know.
Call him out on it and see what he has to say.

Time to call him out!

Agreed. Changing the NC is the wrong move now. Vote it down, send them back, and company will be back in short order. Wasting time burning down and rebuilding our own house isn’t the right move at this time.

The NC did most of what was asked of them but fell short and also considering the delta AIP three days prior to us it should have been a pause to reevaluate. Then JetBlue same should have happened. They still have a chance but I’m thinking it won’t go back without a vote bc Alpa legal probably won’t allow it. Same reason the MEC voted unanimously. They probably didn’t have a choice from a legal standpoint.

It’s up to us now. Vote it down with instructions to come back with JetBlue or better period. Ball is in spirits court at that point and they’ll be forced to play all even if they spin their wheels for a couple weeks waiting for us to rip easch other apart.

Send them back to do what?? Do it correctly? They gave us a TA. This is the best they can do or else they wouldn't have pushed it out. Unless.....nah.

Exactly. They had their chance, they failed to react to the new market conditions, time for them to go.

So, you tossing your hat in the ring to replace them?

Why are you defending their work? This TA will cement us to the bottom of the industry, and god forbid the B6 merger falls through, we will be there for a very long time. Why vote to make $40-$50k less a year than our peers to do the same job? God we have a beat down, battered-wife pilot group.

Good thing you’re off to DAL, where men are men. When’s just class date? Before or after your planned uprising here at Spirit?

Uprising? You mean trying to call a Sh!tty TA out for what it is? And it is the industry norm to replace the NC and even some of the MEC after it fails. Look at United, over there cleaning out the trash as we speak.

I’ll miss you when you’re gone. Stay golden, PonyBoy

Hahaha gayest response ever.

Which is why I knew you would get it.

Technically I wasn’t defending their work, merely asking those insisting the NC be ‘thrown out’ if those people are willing to then step in to replace them. But since you bring it up, I will defend their work. The pilot group was polled and negotiated a deal that was acceptable by the criteria of the polling. But then the environment shifted due to other TAs. But I can certainly see why the NC would like to put this to a vote. Having already gone to the mat negotiating for the current TA proposal, it would be more effective and give the NC more leverage if this is now voted down. Then the NC can start fresh, relieved of compromises they have already made. It’s a clean slate of the old proposal gets shot down.

So you are a Spirit pilot who lives halfway between FLL and MCO who stated you just got a CJO. Per your post yesterday. https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/3...-post3109.html

And you are calling your soon-to-be (or formerly soon-to-be) colleagues "dickheads."

I'm guessing the hiring folks at Delta who peruse these forums will identify you in about 30 seconds.

Just curious, did you have the guts to tell the Delta captain on the interview board he or she was a "d!ckhead?"

c'mon man

this guys not wrong. Jesus bro. Atleast make a burner account before saying how many years left you have in the industry (37 years old) and where you live and your Cjo. Delta truly will hire any schmuck nowadays.

Another Spirit pilot told me to “have fun flying with Dick head Captains.” I responded, to him that I would only have to fly with Dick heads for a year max. Haha nice searching feature though. Must be really getting under the KoolAid yellow juicing voters skins. Let me know if you want a letter of Rec for Delta.

He works for Delta and probably isn’t wild about you entering his ranks soon.

I think you're confusing him with me...I'm the one who posted that and will gladly take credit for it.

I called one of your coworkers a d!ckface (not all delta pilots, just that one), because he acts like a child on our sub:

All I know is that I hope you don't screw up your CJO with Delta........definitely could do without one less tool around here!

But your FOs will have 27 years of you to look forward to.... Would prefer UA over DL for the bases, but aside from that, you would not be the one I would like a recommendation from.

100% agree. But it's a nuanced argument that many don't want to understand because feelings.
MEC should have voted it down and sent it back to the table. They didn't, up to us to do it. No time to clean house. Vote it down and send it back, lfg.

MEC gave the NC their marching orders and they followed them, making it hard for the MEC to then say they fouled up and send them back. If they did, what credibility would the MEC have with the NC?. Or the NC then have with management. It wasn’t that the NC didn’t do the job they were asked to do, it was that the environment changed. H€||, the UA MEC and NC were getting ready to sell out for a fancy suitcase. By comparison, the NK MEC and NC did a great job. But the environment DID change and the environment is the pilot group expectations. If the group votes it down, management just has to accept the environment has changed. If the MEC had sent it back, management wouldn’t know if the NC or the MEC was incompetent or not acting in good faith.

If people want a better deal the pilot group as a whole is going to have to say that. You can’t put it all on the MEC.

Has there ever been a time when NK wasn’t at the bottom of the industry regarding compensation? What changes now? If the industry slides up, and NK is the same ole bottom feeder cheap ass airline, why would anyone expect them to go ahead of any other airline? Kinda gotta take it for what it……is, was, and will always be.

Now if someone can find a way to sell mega cheap tickets and pay their employees the same as a legacy, well there’s the perfect model.