Also true. In the case of NK or JB, the near term JCBA will close the pay gap for narrowbody flying, but won't make up for widebodies (near term anyway) or the retirement wave. But that wave is just that, a wave. The best seniority list spots over the next 20 years have already been filled by youngsters at UAL/DL, and are being filled now at AA.

Like I've said before, this industry is ALWAYS changing.
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Spirit pilots should make less than Legacy pilots because Spirit pilots ass a whole view themselves as a devalued work group. In 2018, 70% voted to make significantly less than Legacy Pilots. In 2022, 70% again voted to make significantly less than Legacy Pilots. As long as 70% of the group keep saying things like…… “It’s just Spirit!” “The ULCC business model can’t afford it.” “Spirit will never pay what Delta pays!!” “We don’t need to make that money because of our work rules.” Then Spirit management will keep owning you guys at the Negotiating table.

I look at it the other way around. Legacy pilots don’t get the quality of life that Spirit pilots get.

you have to ask yourself. Does that extra money make you that much happier or would you rather have quality of life?

Don't know many WB peeps, huh?

And...you're the poster child for that guy's post. "Is the extra $ worth it"

Maybe not to you, but that doesn't mean the entire pilot group should be worth less IMO.

I was thinking the same thing.

Counterpoint though is when you have a mangament group that just says no and the NMB puts you on ice for months and you know you won’t get released where do go?

This sentiment always makes me laugh, particularly when you occasionally have Ex Spirit pilots at legacies visit these forums and say "Yes, my QOL is much better now, I am making more money and working less" But some of you just put your fingers in your ears and act like they are deluded.

There is no reason ULCC pilots shouldn't have parity with the similar equipment payscale at the legacies and Southwest if we vote in this TA. None whatsoever.

This is also sort of a byproduct of having such a young pilot group. When you are in your early 20's you think $30K is like $300K. As you age, gain responsibilities, expenses and toys, you later realize that every $$$ can be put to good use.

You forgot the restraining order too...

For sure and understood. Not saying there's an easy way to get there from here. Wish there was for everyone.

Very good point. If you've been busting your hump for a decade or two, every dollar less than commensurate compensation feels more like a FU - especially with some of the RJ rates. Probably a much different view if your college, ramen, CFI days are a recent memory, which is happening more and more in the current hiring environment.

I mean we are in unprecedented times that won't last.....but movement on the narrow body at UAL is much quicker than Spirit and Big Blue.....so new people gotta be askin....aaaaaa why stay here? For QOL that I don't yet have?

Think of all those Miata after market parts. The possibilities are endless!

All those miata parts you can put on with your 20 days off and go race during the weekend!!!

Real men race on dirt.

Top post of forum. Good stuff.

Miata?

MAN CARD-----REVOKED!!!

your right, let me park the miata next to my subaru and get to a rally event.

dirt, track, anything will be fun with the days off!

I hereby rescind your invitation to the Airline Pilot Miata Owners Club

Exactly. Granted this BS was said by Halon (one of the biggest moron trolls here at NK, but this sentiment runs deep with some NK guys).

I left 10 months ago. I already bid 64% in base/fleet (the 🚌) and have 18 off this month. Currently perusing the ole APC on my Balcony finishing up a week long cruise. My life is completely dog$hit.

DTZ was great and I had a good 4 years at NK, but some of you have to truly start understanding that people’s lives aren’t miserable elsewhere. I absolutely love it where I’m at now.

Ahhh…to be you!

18 days off and on a weeklong cruise. I think you sold me now!

You’re still in his head lol

Can we finally put to bed the notion that only NK has good QOL, finally?

Thanks for the post Bear.

Idk about that one, Chief. My junior buddies at B6 have dog**** schedules and nothing they can do about it. Bear has seniority in BES so he gets good QOL. Hard press to find good QOL for junior pilots at B6.

where are you now? curious
if you don't wnat mention airline, I understand. But at least, mainiline or something?
thx

If he's moved up to 64% in less than a year and was previously at NK, then I'd bet yes, he's at a legacy.

This mentality will never go away at Spirit. The pilots here believe it's the only airline where pilots can get holidays and weekends off.

Anyone who truly believes that is just dumb.

The truth of the matter is nostalgia. People who now are very senior doing day trips think back to their former lives. A life where our point-to-point system was one leg a day, 3 hrs of block for 5 hours pay, 5 hours pay for >22 hr overnight or whatever it was before the change, etc, etc. Also, crew scheduling was just so incredibly inept it worked out to their benefit many many times.

Currently, it has almost become more hub and spoke like here. All those one-leg out and one-leg back 2-day trips LGA, DTW, IAH, CLE, etc, etc are pretty much gone out of the bid package (at the moment anyhow, though they declined significantly that past few years). Crew scheduling has also apparently finally learned to read the contract and is exercising their end as you would expect in any normal airline - adding turns at the end of a trip to a reserve pilot, moving days off, etc, etc.

So, yeah can still drop to zero, can still call sick with no "points" or any other kind of repercussion. I guess that's "QoL"...

Spirit RSV is the worst in the industry. We gave up the farm on RSV in 2018

dumb, nobody is arguing that.

Even though I know you are being sarcastic at least make a valid argument to back up your point.