sinkrate3278

I was checking out the approach plates for IAD and noticed that the ILS Cat II approaches don't have a Maltese cross to identify the FAF on the charts. Why not?

Thanks!

jonnybegreg

Glide slope intercept is faf for all ils, Maltese cross is for non-precision only

sinkrate3278

Oops, you're right. It was for the ILS or LOC. thanks! Sorry about that.

TonyC

An ILS approach does not have a Final Approach FIX.


Not exactly. There is no Final Approach FIX. The Final Approach SEGMENT begins at the point where the glideslope intersects the glideslope intercept altitude.


An example: The Glideslope Intercept Altitude for a given ILS approach is 2,000'. You are vectored to final at 3,000', cleared for the approach, and you intercept the localizer and then the glideslope at 3,000'. You are not on the Final Approach segment (where certain rules about weather and continuing the approach come into play). Although you have intercepted the glideslope, you have not reached the point where it intersects the glideslope intercept altitude. While descending on the glideslope, when you reach 2,000' you are then on the Final Approach segment.


If there's a LOC approach depicted, there should be a Final Approach Fix.






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xjtguy

More commonly known as the "lowest published glide slope intercept altitude".

TonyC

That's funny. For something that is "more commonly known", I would have thought I would have at least heard it or read it somewhere -- I can't recall that I have.

Here's an excerpt from an April 11, 2012 FAA Press Release titled "FAA Releases Updated Guidance on Instrument Landing System Intercepts" (it followed and referenced Information for Operators (InFO) 11009 "Failure to Comply with Minimum Crossing Altitudes at Stepdown Fixes Located on Instrument Landing System (ILS) Inbound Courses":
No mention of "lowest published glide slope intercept altitude" in the article.


I can't think of an example off the top of my head, and I may be recalling incorrectly, but I seem to remember seeing approaches where lower glideslope intercept altitudes are published "By ATC". I don't know what the definition of "lowest published glide slope intercept altitude" is, but stands to reason that such an altitude would be the lowest published, and yet not coincident with the beginning of the final approach segment, the lightning bolt (government charts), the feather(Jeppesen), or the "P" (LIDO).






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ddd333

Correct me if I'm wrong, but all CAT II ILS approaches at IAD are just that.... ILS.
Not ILS OR LOC. Therefore, no FAF.
All of the ILS OR LOC approaches have a cross.

xjtguy

I probably should have used "more commonly referred to by pilots as" instead of "more commonly known".

captain152

All Cat II approaches everywhere are strictly Cat II. Not "...or LOC". If it has Cat II capability it'll for sure have Cat I, and possibly a LOC approach as well.

At least I've never seen an approach plate for a Cat II with any other approach built in.

TonyC

Ehh, that doesn't do anything for me either. You see, I consider myself to be a pilot.









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