FAR 135.223 clarification
09-29-2013, 07:44 PM
#1
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FAR 135.223 clarification
OK so this really may be a stupid question but I'm sitting here studying my FAR's for a new job and had a question on 135.223 which requires, that an hour before to an hour after your ETA the forecast is at least 1500' above the lowest useable circling approach MDA (for your category) OR 2000' AGL (whichever is great); and 2 SM above the circling visibility or 3 SM (whichever is greater).
Can someone explain to me a situation where the 2000' AGL would be greater? Most circling MDA's are 600' AGL or greater, right?
Thanks.
Can someone explain to me a situation where the 2000' AGL would be greater? Most circling MDA's are 600' AGL or greater, right?
Thanks.
09-29-2013, 08:38 PM
#2
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Your trying to figure out if you need an alternate right.
So if circle mins are 420+1500=1920.
If wx at eta +- 1hr is forcast at 2000 and vis 4 mile
then per the reg no alt required.
Less fuel, more pax.
But if circle mins are 600+1500=2100
when you need an alternate.
More fuel, less pax.
Clear as mud now?
So if circle mins are 420+1500=1920.
If wx at eta +- 1hr is forcast at 2000 and vis 4 mile
then per the reg no alt required.
Less fuel, more pax.
But if circle mins are 600+1500=2100
when you need an alternate.
More fuel, less pax.
Clear as mud now?
10-01-2013, 04:08 AM
#3
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Posts: 314
Originally Posted by yz450f177
Your trying to figure out if you need an alternate right.
So if circle mins are 420+1500=1920.
If wx at eta +- 1hr is forcast at 2000 and vis 4 mile
then per the reg no alt required.
Less fuel, more pax.
But if circle mins are 600+1500=2100
when you need an alternate.
More fuel, less pax.
Clear as mud now?
So if circle mins are 420+1500=1920.
If wx at eta +- 1hr is forcast at 2000 and vis 4 mile
then per the reg no alt required.
Less fuel, more pax.
But if circle mins are 600+1500=2100
when you need an alternate.
More fuel, less pax.
Clear as mud now?
Where will you find circling mins of less than 500' ?
OP, to answer your question, I can only assume that there are probably some category A/B/C (and maybe even D/E) circling mins less than 500' in flatland, low elevation airport/s
10-01-2013, 04:43 AM
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Originally Posted by nfnsquared
You didn't read his whole post...
Where will you find circling mins of less than 500' ?
OP, to answer your question, I can only assume that there are probably some category A/B/C (and maybe even D/E) circling mins less than 500' in flatland, low elevation airport/s
Where will you find circling mins of less than 500' ?
OP, to answer your question, I can only assume that there are probably some category A/B/C (and maybe even D/E) circling mins less than 500' in flatland, low elevation airport/s
http://skyvector.com/files/tpp/1310/pdf/00684VD30.PDF
10-01-2013, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Phxdvt17
the forecast is at least 1500' above the lowest useable circling approach MDA (for your category) OR 2000' AGL (whichever is great); and 2 SM above the circling visibility or 3 SM (whichever is greater).
Can someone explain to me a situation where the 2000' AGL would be greater? Most circling MDA's are 600' AGL or greater, right?
Thanks.
Can someone explain to me a situation where the 2000' AGL would be greater? Most circling MDA's are 600' AGL or greater, right?
Thanks.
(1) The ceiling will be at least 1,500 feet above the lowest circling approach MDA;OR
(2) If a circling instrument approach is not authorized for the airport, the ceiling will be at least 1,500 feet above the lowest published minimum or 2,000 feet above the airport elevation, whichever is higher;"
So, this means that if the airport has usable circling minimums, you don't need to worry about the 2,000ft agl requirement (for exactly the reason you mentioned = the majority of circling approaches have mins that would put you over 2,000ft agl anyways with some exceptions)
Now, if the airport your going to does NOT have circling minimums ("Circling NA" or just not listed = Straight In only), then you have to apply the "OR 2,000ft AGL" requirement.
An example of this is the ILS X RWY 12 Pangborn Airport (KEAT) in Wenatchee, WA
http://skyvector.com/files/tpp/1310/pdf/00641IX12.PDF
In this case HAT(313ft) + 1,500 = 1,818 ft < 2,000 ft so you'd use 2,000 AGL for your cloud ceiling threshold for Alt filing purposes.
Last edited by Fly Boy Knight; 10-01-2013 at 09:48 AM.
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