In leu of the Midwest situation, what would the UAW do if GM, Ford, or who ever fired all the workers. Then the next day brought in a whole new group to do the same work for less money in different factories? This isn't a political jab, but where's the govt. now for these workers? The employees that have given 10-20-30 years to this company, and now some kid will fly the route at a fraction of the price. Where is ALPA? Is there nothing that can be done for the employees of Midwest? Where is the press on CNN about this? Blows my mind.

This whole situation should disturb all of us in the airline industry to the extreme. How fast can you be undercut to fly the public around for $20 tickets?

What would the UAW do? What would the local machinists 575 do?

 

What would you have the government do?

 

I would get my membership revoked again for making "political" speak. Sooooooo nothin i guess. The people voted for "change".

 

Hasn't history shown that maybe the UAW isn't really a model to be copied?

I've recently seen only that to really be fair to passengers and crew and make a profit is pretty impossible in the aviation industry. the fees passed onto the customer would approach astronomical.
should this be done, and flying is no longer a right, as so many attest to, a lot of us are out of a job because our customer base shrinks significantly.

I figure lose lose at this point.

Livin the dream

 

Doesn't matter. Nothing the unions will, or can, do will matter as long as the FAA (US Government) maintains it's position that all airlines are equally safe. The airlines contribute to the problem because their lawyers won't let them advertise safety.

When one thinks about it, the FAA sets the standards for our job. If a pilot reaches that standard level, the FAA blesses everything he/she touches with "one level of safety". At that point, there is no difference in a companies eye, or in the flying public's eye, between Chesly Sullenberger and the Colgan Captain who didn't know how to recover from an inadvertent stall. They were both blessed by the US Government as being competent and qualified airline Captains. End of story.

Your UAW scenario does not apply because your hypothetical would be for replacing all of the workers at a production facility. If Midex were to dump ALPA tomorrow, and fly the Midex airplanes with non ALPA pilots, that would be replacing the workers at a production facility. In that case, the Gummint would not allow it to happen. What were looking at is nothing more than outsourcing, and nothing can fix that as long as the product is seen as interchangeable. See the first paragraph.

What I wish would happen is that John Prater would use his relationship with Obama to gain pilot certification status for ALPA. If ALPA were to be able to bless a pilot in the same way that Bar Associations bless lawyers and the AMA blesses Dr's, then we would have the ability to control our careers. Until then, the marketplace will rule. Either directly for non-Union carriers or indirectly as we are seeing at Midex.

 

No thank you. Unlike your examples, none are labor unions. And further, maybe you didn't get the memo, but ALPA doesn't represent all pilots. I would never want them to be given government sponsored monopoly over our careers.

It's actually scary that there is at least one person who thought this a good enough idea to actually write it down.

 

It's actually not such a bad idea. Every other union controls entry into its field. If ALPA and the other unions controlled the barriers to entry into the marketplace we could stop the never ending supply of cheap labor in the form of the 200 hour flight school grad flying Part 121. That endless supply depresses our wages. Furthermore we could stop the impending disaster of the Multi Pilot License. http://http://www.atwonline.com/magazine/article.html?articleID=1876

 

How would you have ALPA control "entry into the marketplace"?

How would one define the "marketplace" they were to control?

 

I am talking the labor market. Pipe fitters, electricians, plumbers, et al have control over who and how one becomes part of said profession/vocation. Admittedly those powers have been diluted over the years as more and non union workers have entered the work force. Depending on the state though, union membership is either required or shop fees are charged. As it is now we have no control over who becomes a pilot or how that happens. That simple fact, I think, is the major reason our wages as a group have seen so much negative pressure of the last 10 years. The entire regional airline model revolves around the ready supply of cheap pilot labor.

The government won't do it on their own but if ALPA (and I use them because it's easier to type) had a hand in how pilot licenses are granted and what was required to be an Airline Transport Pilot, it would go a long way towards reducing the supply thus increasing the price.

 

You can graduate from law school with a J.D. and never practice law a day in your life.

You can graduate med school with an M.D. and never practice medicine a day in your life.

I hold an ATP and have never been required per FARs to hold one.

I'm a former ALPA member and volunteer myself, but ALPA has no right or business dictating who can and cannot hold a commercial pilot's licence or ATP (or what those standards must be).

Regulating your specific segment of industry (ie airlines) is one thing, but a blanket right to impose their will on an industry as a whole isn't an acceptable situation just so airline pilots can artificially shrink the pilot pool in an attempt to raise their own wages.