I think if all regionals had the same contract with the same pay and work rules that would limit undercutting. that is what I mean. ALPA negotiates one contract for all the regionals similar to auto workers at the big 3. If ALPA is successful in bringing back scope that would obviously be preferred

Aaayyyyyyupp! Or part of the diehard "I hate unions" crowd. I think if I hated unions that bad, I'd opt for a corp flying job.

I’ll give the guy credit for voicing his true feelings instead of staying silent. I would rather have someone let me know what they’re thinking. This gives us an opportunity to change their misguided beliefs on scope.

THIS!!!

Scope relaxation has been voted on by the pilots every time except once.

EX CON’s voted to relax scope, L-Ual pilots voted to relax scope. EX RJ pilots voted to relax scope. Furloughs voted to relax scope. There is no stereotype or group that owns scope relaxation.

If you want to see a picture of the pilot who needs to be convinced that scope is a no concession item on the next TA look in the mirror.

As a former "zoomie" with the screen name to follow it, I think it's shallow for the OP to paint with such a broad brush.

Every airline has it's "kool aid" drinkers or "me me me" crowd, and that isn't limited to the zoomie alma mater. I would venture to guess that there are two large percentage universities that people attended at all airlines, which are more a function of where we train pilots in this country than anything else.

We have Embry Riddle and USAFA with probably the two largest percentages. This is only my guesstimate, and then some USNA and some universities with large aviation programs, then probably 80% of everyone else goes to any one of 1000's of colleges. When you have colleges like USAFA and Embry Riddle that 50-60% of the graduates fly for a living, then you will fly with those pilots more often than you might bump into someone that went to UNC Chapel Hill, for example.

I won't discount that there are grads that personify the stereotype which you speak about. These folks are more than likely not a higher percentage than the general pilot population at any airline.

It's true that many military folks need to be educated on the history of the airline and it's union culture. Don't expect to hand guys a book (FTL Vol I and II) as a new hire and tell them to "read it" and take notes. Now if you share with them the history behind the books, then they might ask where they can learn more. When they ask more, then they will be open for learning, then you point them towards the proper literature.

Be part of the solution and help educate these folks that are "newbie's" to the airline world. If you point your finger and tell them that they are wrong, you will get most military folks to fight back with their argument, so help be part of the solution and mentor these folks.

I was once a "newbie" from the military and a former USAFA grad, but I had great guys from ASA and Expressjet and Jetblue educate me when I was a newhire that helped me navigate a 2000 page legal document which we call the UPA. It's honestly very overwhelming to start a new job, then be told to "fly the contract" which is written in legalese. Hopefully, we have good LCAs and junior CAs who are willing to mentor both the 23 year old newhire (who no one knows how they got hired) and the 42 year old military newhire (who has no experience with unions or pilot contracts).

Be careful with stereotype, lest you become one yourself.

But didn't they do it with a gun to their head?


There are three kinds of guns that get pointed to the heads of pilot unions/groups.

1. Financial calamity that the company created due to poor management. This gun gets sympathy from the pilots.

2. Financial calamity that someone else created due to circumstances beyond our control. This gun gets sympathy from the pilots.

3. Financial calamity affecting their own lot in life due to their age/demographic, or unique issue (scab), they feel "entitled" to help, they in turn appeal to all other pilots to garner sympathy and their vote to provide relief or fix their problem.

God I cringe when I walk into the crew room, meet my CA for the next 4 days and see that ring. I like finding out on day 2 that a guy is a grad, because that means he’s probably letting his work speak for him and not some rolled mold of gems and gold.

Favorite line so far when it comes out that I’m also one of them “well my son, wife, uncle, brother in law, father and dog are grads and we all wear our rings and give to the endowment! You need to take pride in the institution that’s given you so much!”

It’s like they’re out to make the entire group look bad.

OK, so your probably just a troll and I know we're not supposed to feed the likes of you, but...

Wow, sounds like you might be the one with the issue. You really have that much of a problem with the jewelry that a guy/gal wears. So your the standard "judge the book by it's cover" guy. Haven't we moved past that as a society on the whole? Am I allowed to wear a cross or a star of David on a necklace or would that cause you issues too when you show up?

Sounds like one of these guys/gals could only be so lucky to fly with the likes of you.

The generalization I was keying on was from post #20. That there is some mass trend of mil poor attitudes towards our union. I don’t doubt that RJ pilots want to come to a major airline accelerated by taking back flying lost after 9/11 and Great Recession.
I disagree, it is the fault of the pilots with few exceptions for continuing to vote for weak contracts to knowingly take dangled planes and routes from another union RJ carrier as part of the signing deal.
I want to make clear I support Union RJ pilots but call bull to the premise that mil pilot hires don’t figure out who their team is vice a 10+year willing participant in eating Mgmt whipsawdust.

That’s what you got out of it? The jewelry?

Well, colonel, RTF reply and you’ll have your answer. Something about letting their work speak for who they are. But if you like to feel like you deserve anything because of where you went to school, I disagree, but you’re good to go...can’t dictate anyone else’s feelings.