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-   -   May - eSRL Round 2 (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/united/128833-may-esrl-round-2-a.html)

HuggyU2 04-06-2020 11:38 PM


Originally Posted by Bestglide (Post 3025555)
people are not angry with the company, but with the union for the Recent concession ESRLs LOA instead of keeping the 50hr SRL already in our contract. Do blame them for turning us into independent contractors.
I hope round 2 is still a failure and round 3 restores the 50 hr SRL.
my point was that if enough people hold out the company will sweeten the pot even further.
If they don’t sweeten the pot then they will b paying me 73 hours v.s. 50 hours
either way I’ll be home with thousands on reserve.

Thanks... good perspective.

I might be wrong, but I don't believe the company violated the contract... therefore no "concession" was made. I have seen other posts where the poster railed on the company for their offering. I realize they have to offer what they think will work. That's how it is done. I also keep in mind Dubinsky's quote about the golden goose.

I do agree with you that the membership is not "approving" and we will wait for a better offer... or stick to bidding (reserve or lines) as it is. No argument there.

rp2pilot 04-07-2020 02:08 AM


Originally Posted by Firsttimeflyer (Post 3025730)
The difference in pay between 40 hours and 73 hours (not counting the delayed 10 hours for single month since they risk it in bankruptcy) is more than the average American makes a month. Almost a 50% pay cut...
I still can’t believe the Union agreed to this to start since it was already in the UPA for SRL lines.
Apparently we have a lot of fishermen in management.

The MEC is privy to company financial data and has paid analysts to determine how much cash the company is burning. The ESrl's were negotiated prior to the passage of the Relief package. Nobody wants furloughs;. in that context, ,the ESRL's make more sense. When September 30th rolls around, the Hoi Polloi will be screaming at the union to cut everyone's hours and pay guarantees to avoid furloughing.

Andy 04-07-2020 02:36 AM


Originally Posted by Firsttimeflyer (Post 3025730)
The difference in pay between 40 hours and 73 hours (not counting the delayed 10 hours for single month since they risk it in bankruptcy) is more than the average American makes a month. Almost a 50% pay cut...
I still can’t believe the Union agreed to this to start since it was already in the UPA for SRL lines.
Apparently we have a lot of fishermen in management.

Phrasing this another way, 40 hours' pay to do nothing is more than the average American makes in a month. TBH, I'll make more than my wife, a charge nurse who makes low 6 figures, makes for busting her kiester. And I'll be lounging around the house all summer.

Andy 04-07-2020 03:01 AM


Originally Posted by Bestglide (Post 3025555)
people are not angry with the company, but with the union for the Recent concession ESRLs LOA instead of keeping the 50hr SRL already in our contract. Do blame them for turning us into independent contractors.
I hope round 2 is still a failure and round 3 restores the 50 hr SRL.
my point was that if enough people hold out the company will sweeten the pot even further.
If they don’t sweeten the pot then they will b paying me 73 hours v.s. 50 hours
either way I’ll be home with thousands on reserve.

NOT independent contractors. We have a choice of what we want to do, just like those that choose to either stay in a seat and have better seniority vs those that bid for higher paying equipment at first opportunity.
Pilots with choices, not independent contractors.

If they sweeten the pot to 50 hrs, I suppose anyone (ie you) accepting an SRL is no longer an independent contractor? Funny how that works.

CousinEddie 04-07-2020 05:38 AM


Originally Posted by Andy (Post 3025816)
Phrasing this another way, 40 hours' pay to do nothing is more than the average American makes in a month. TBH, I'll make more than my wife, a charge nurse who makes low 6 figures, makes for busting her kiester. And I'll be lounging around the house all summer.

That is the reality check post I was waiting for.

rp2pilot 04-07-2020 05:40 AM


Originally Posted by Andy (Post 3025816)
Phrasing this another way, 40 hours' pay to do nothing is more than the average American makes in a month. TBH, I'll make more than my wife, a charge nurse who makes low 6 figures, makes for busting her kiester. And I'll be lounging around the house all summer.

^ ^^^^^^
This! I had vacation in March and so I've spent the last 30 days "at home" (No place to go on vacation this year), and it's given me a chance to see what I spend in a month just sitting at home, no gas, no airport meals, no Starbucks, etc. I'm easily earning more with a 50 hour line (and probably 40 hour line) than I spend in a month. Food, shelter, clothing is NOT an issue, so why not enjoy spending time with my family.

Bestglide 04-07-2020 05:49 AM


Originally Posted by Andy (Post 3025819)
NOT independent contractors. We have a choice of what we want to do, just like those that choose to either stay in a seat and have better seniority vs those that bid for higher paying equipment at first opportunity.
Pilots with choices, not independent contractors.

If they sweeten the pot to 50 hrs, I suppose anyone (ie you) accepting an SRL is no longer an independent contractor? Funny how that works.

I guess we can agree to disagree here. Again why did the union get this LOA out rite before the grant moneys?
why did the union give up what was IN the contract? For something less valuable? A concession imo
Yes it gives us CHOICES, not very good ones in comparison to what we had.

ChrisJT6 04-07-2020 07:21 AM


Originally Posted by rp2pilot (Post 3025813)
The MEC is privy to company financial data and has paid analysts to determine how much cash the company is burning. The ESrl's were negotiated prior to the passage of the Relief package. Nobody wants furloughs;. in that context, ,the ESRL's make more sense. When September 30th rolls around, the Hoi Polloi will be screaming at the union to cut everyone's hours and pay guarantees to avoid furloughing.

My feedback to LEC rep was to push to temporarily cut guarantees now across the board and put it out to a vote. The announcements will be sent well before 30Sep. This isn’t something new...with the exception of the United Pilot MEC during the Great Recession, almost every union pilot group mitigated furloughs using this form of unionism. There should be a big fight about stock buybacks after, but It is a farce to refer to unions mitigating furloughs through shared pain as a “concession”. I hope we are not a majority group that would vote to okay flying 90+ hr lines while thousands of our pilots go bankrupt and loose there homes.

Thor 04-07-2020 08:45 AM


Originally Posted by ChrisJT6 (Post 3026002)
My feedback to LEC rep was to push to temporarily cut guarantees now across the board and put it out to a vote. The announcements will be sent well before 30Sep. This isn’t something new...with the exception of the United Pilot MEC during the Great Recession, almost every union pilot group mitigated furloughs using this form of unionism. There should be a big fight about stock buybacks after, but It is a farce to refer to unions mitigating furloughs through shared pain as a “concession”. I hope we are not a majority group that would vote to okay flying 90+ hr lines while thousands of our pilots go bankrupt and loose there homes.

If you want to convince anyone of anything, you may want to refine your message. All I got is nobody wants a loose house.

ChrisJT6 04-07-2020 08:51 AM


Originally Posted by Thor (Post 3026117)
If you want to convince anyone of anything, you may want to refine your message. All I got is nobody wants a loose house.

reverse the past trend. Share pain across the entire pilot group to save jobs. There you go.


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