Airline Pilot Central Forums - Agreement In Principle

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At AA our Check Pilots get $0 override. That should give everyone an idea of how far behind we are.

Good for United. I hope it looks good when the fine print is read.

So excited by all this big talk of a great contract I can’t wait for the classifieds to come out in the Sunday paper. Looking for a real sweet Miata!

Quote:

Originally Posted by AAL24 (Post 3422394)

You have to understand the context. Over at American we are a bunch of beaten dogs. 3 years of negotiations and we have an aip on moving expenses and pre planned absences. Our contract is garbage and we have many things which still haven’t been implemented after years under our current contract.

The company has offered us a 4% raise and $65 million in Quality of life improvements. Probably a fraction of the amount of dollar gains UAL just offered you guys. If APA put the 4% offer out for vote it would probably be close. Our 2 negotiators have been using union paid trip drops to credit between 150-200 hours each month during our “intensive” negotiations. Many of our pilots just don’t care anymore or they are so out of touch they have no idea how far behind APA has fallen. They have a couple years left and just want a few more dollars before hanging it up. Started on the B scale, ending on the B scale. .

I totally get it. There was a great reset in this industry 20 years ago. IMO those old guys you reference at AMR do get it. Many have seen the worst this industry has to offer. The majority of the captains I flew with at United wouldn’t vote for a substandard contract because they wanted to leave our careers on a better footing. These guys were furloughed, sat sideways for 17 years, struck, honored a picket line, fired/rehired, and had their contract decimated.

I hope this agreement is an all inclusive, eye watering, complete rewrite. I have my doubts. Lord knows they’ve had enough time to do it. Hopefully someone has the will to insist on a real contract vs another extension in sheep’s clothing explained away with “we’ll get ‘em next time.” If and when that happens we’ll all benefit.

Best of luck to you guys.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TodKindrsChikun (Post 3422422)

great post and good luck to you too! Our union has decided to negotiate a “targeted approach” which is more or less a contract extension with some improvements. The idea was that we could get a quick base hit and be back in negotiations in 18 months. Clearly that strategy is not working. Hopefully you guys are pleasantly surprised when the details of the AIP are released

Quote:

Originally Posted by TodKindrsChikun (Post 3422422)

Yet that same group, in a quest for big $$$$s, opened the door wide to let the Trojan horse enter. Ironic really. We're all smart enough, and have seen enough, to not fall for the same tricks again. Just read the entire TA, use some critical thinking skills, discuss w/mature peers, use a little more of that gray matter - then cast your informed vote. Ignore the 5% at each extreme.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lenticularis (Post 3422414)

So excited by all this big talk of a great contract I can’t wait for the classifieds to come out in the Sunday paper. Looking for a real sweet Miata!

Check with this youtuber. She bought her Miata in 2020. She'll probably sell it to you for a good price.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AxlF16 (Post 3422431)

I’d contend the value of C2000 was driven to make up for the losses of the ESOP cuts. Those raises were essentially cost of living adjustments for the 1995-2000 period. Yes the nose entered the tent but bankruptcy burnt those tents to the ground allowing unfettered access. Hindsight is a valuable tool if you can apply it retroactively. Fully agree with the rest of your sentiment and hopefully it works out for us.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guppydriver95 (Post 3421840)

20%?!?! Not. Even. Close. 11% inflation this year alone!

That’s not really how inflation works. The markets are actually forecasting pretty average inflation over the next 30 years. It’s not like this year is 11%, then next year is 9% more, then 12% more compounding ad astra.

A 20% raise is substantial. The 2 numbers do not correlate. Please educate yourselves on elementary economics before panic-voting no… or posting sensationally, for that matter.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AxlF16 (Post 3422431)

”Just read the entire TA, use some critical thinking skills, discuss w/mature peers, use a little more of that gray matter - then cast your informed vote”. You do realize that that this is APC Forum???🤣😂🤣

Quote:

Originally Posted by fcoolaiddrinker (Post 3422393)

PS commute is a benefit to the company as well so it’s difficult to place a numeric value on it.

The benefits to the company probably aren't as big as you imagine and I don't think most people in support of PS have looked at the massive revenue hit that it is when load factors are up (North of 80% pre-covid and higher for flights during the reasonable hours). I heard someone at Delta in one of their townhalls bring this same point up. Management's answer was schedule reliability actually went down with PS. They said it was mostly because people gave themselves no wiggle room so when there were issues with the plane or ATC etc. it was an immediate hit that was hard to cover. Before people were commuting with back ups in place.