What’s your opinion?

1) The Negotiationing Committee should take the Delta TA as is and ask the company to match it and get an offer on the table now.
2) The Negotiationing Committee should sit down with the company and start new negotiations asking for multiple improvements above those in the Delta TA.

 

Check your premises.

The MEC is still waiting for recall results of the C171 (IAH) Chair and an interim and permanent FO rep along with the final election results in C57 (LAX). They will also elect a MC likely by the end of January.

Hopefully, they can give the NC some marching orders based on what they know of the Delta pilots' AIP, but the company was unresponsive using Delta's deal as an excuse. What we want to ask for regarding sick leave, STD, LTD, reserve improvements and other work rules will not be simple, but our initial ask will obviously exceed Delta's deal.

Negotiating 101.

 

Nothing will move forward until DAL has a ratified contract.

If it does pass the “floor” would be the starting point for us.

 

Meant to include a poll but I’m on an iPad and it didn’t work. Don’t suppose a mod could change this to a poll? Otherwise I suppose I can just try again later.

 

Taking the Delta agreement as is would only make sense if everything in it is better than our current book. My understanding is that under their proposal we’d give up first class deadheading and current reassignment protections as just a couple of examples. Any deal that they get is the foundation that we build on. We shouldn’t give up any current rules or protections, only improve them. If their proposal passes ratification we will have the time to analyze it and put in real world examples across the seniority spectrum and see how the math works out. We need to do this right, not fast.

 

Perhaps my assumptions are naïve but I start with the assumption that when I say “Delta TA” the implication is our current contract plus Delta’s improvements with zero “gives”. My second assumption is this is not a total rewrite of our current contract rather adding of QOL and pay changes so “ getting it right” this time should be straight forward and take weeks not months.

I am a lucky man and hopefully I will retire early within a couple years and have my financial ducks all in a row so this contract cycle will have little to no impact on my future but what I am concerned about and what drives my question is what I perceive (perhaps incorrectly) as a common sentiment at UAL that there is much to be gained above the gains in the Delta TA.

To be clear it is my understanding that the DeltaTA includes improvements across the board that are fairly simple to implement such as pay per vacation day, pay per training day, pay for SCs, pay for holidays, pay for all reassignments, limits on reassignment length, limits on number of SCs, etc. Further I fear pilots in favor of taking time to “get it right” may not have put a number on the cost of waiting.

In round numbers each month that passes without a contract is costing individual pilots $3k or more. That’s including forgone pay raises and interest on retro. So any “gains” must be worth the cost. 6 months extra $20k for whatever improvements we get. 9 months $30k. Worst case . . . The economy falls into recession and the company chooses to pull all offers.

So again assuming we’re talking about an offer with zero gives and most or all of Delta’s gets what does “getting it right” mean and more importantly how much are pilots willing to pay to “get it right”?

 

Can we get the Delta Negotiators over here on FTFPL for a few months? I'll buy their steak and cake if they work with our NC. I understand their motives aren't exactly aligned since it would be rational for them to favor pay over work rules. But I think their input would be valuable for reserve, sick time, retirement, and other issues. If we want all of Delta's gains I think we need some people with a deep understanding of those gains over here ASAP. We're both ALPA, right? So why not?

 

I think that we’re in agreement for the most part. We have 15,000+ opinions as to what the ideal contract should look like, and everyone won’t be happy. I never have understood the mantra about insisting on a total rewrite. Some sections need more work than others, but most of any new contract is keeping the parts that you like and addressing the parts that you don’t. If Delta ratifies a new contract, hopefully we follow with something worth voting on, however I’d expect it to take several months to get to that point. We can write what ever we want, but the company still has to sign off on it. We’ll see what Delta gets and how serious Kirby is about us moving forward.

 

If the company wants to fix narrowbody CAP vacancies, they need to fix reserves. Reserves needed to be fixed regardless.

No FSB's, unless proven use for irregular ops only (Hurricane, bomb cyclone, etc..).
SCs cannot be made after 1300, unless irregular ops.
Reserves should have higher MPG with more days off. 14 min days off vs 12.
Remove visiting reserve.
Cannot assign reserve into a line month, without day restoration.
Limit rolling days off.
Allow Reserves to pick up PP on days off or allow reserve the same %PP amount if having to wait after line holders haven't grabbed after a set time (15 mins).

I'm a NO without reserve fixes. This part of the UPA was supposed to be fixed for this round of negotiations. Nothing was accomplished.

 

Get rid of global.

when you pick up a trip or are assigned a trip, you get the same benefits/protections as a line holder (reassignment, etc)