UalHvy

Wanna bet? The IPAD is cheaper than revisions on a large scale over the course of time. JEPPS rep has already confirmed it.

Sunvox

Sometimes I fall behind the debate as "the real world" gets in the way . . . Anywhoooo... I'll field this one for sure ...

UPS does NOT have pay banding in any shape or form what so ever but rather has a Pay-to-Seniority payscale because they are, have been, and always will be the ultimate in Socialist companies hence the whole point regarding moving to a single band, and I don't mean that in a negative way simply as a matter of fact. Pay-to-Seniority is an all together different animal and one which I personally favor and would even be willing to sacrifice myself for.


If you ask me we should have a national seniority list based on the day you get your military wings or the day you get your ATP and after that you should hold seniority and pay based on your age whilst individual corporations should be free to negotiate work rules with their pilot groups in an attempt to garner efficiencies. Not that that will ever happen, but at heart I'm a romantic so I always hold out hope that someday we can all work together.



Cheers,

Joe

Bph320

Ya, I'll bet. When was the last time UAL did anything that made sense?

syd111

What does being cheaper have to do with anything, please keep in mind that even going from all of us carrying a flight bag to shipsets was a cost neutral move. The people they had working on the shipsets took 3 years to come up with something that does not save any money.

Nothing like being on special assignment.

SoCalGuy

Joe....

Hope the weekend finds you well, and you are far from the grind of work.

I got your PM, and it's clear that you 'thirst' for further debate on the topic. In finishing my trip yesterday afternoon, I keyed up the 'ol IPhone to find our MEC Chair's weekly brief (which I'm sure WM did the same to her camp). Since the updates regarding our JCBA's general progress seem to be 'ironically similar' from our respective leadership, I'm sure you read something 'similar'....or even a carbon-copy! In this week's read, the respective MEC's appeared pleased that the NC's are rapidly working through their differences concerning previously cited compensation 'riffs'.....with that I am encouraged. Both sides have obviously voiced their opinion's on the topic, and from there, seem to be foraging forth to mend those views into a workable JCBA to keep the process moving forward.

Whatever your view is on the topic, I respect that you have a 'view'. This entire thing started pages back when you clearly stated the following:
If you read what you wrote in clear terms, it does not hold water....nothing more, nothing less. On your last post you refer to UPS's pay structure as "Pay-to-Seniority".....with that I understand. The one all encompassing factor which you deny (or not willing to see) is that ALL FLEET types are Banded together within their company. This entire Banding vs Unbanding topic came about with CAL/UAL when it was purposed to have the B777 & B747 Banded together.....just as UPS combines a "Band", which happens to be their entire fleet. If it sits better with you, we can call it a "Big" Band (UPS's ALL fleets) vs a "Small" Band (CAL/UALs B747/777).....It's still "Banding".

When your talking about Seniority, your entering the 'graph' on the "X" axis.....When your referring to "Band" of aircraft type, your entering on the "Y" axis.....It maybe "Ying/Yang" such as your Avitar, but it's still "apples v oranges".....Capeesh Joe??

The topic - "would the UPS structure hold up to a UAL ability to foster"??? There are TON's of varibles and considerations as to if it could/or could not. The ONLY point that I have been citing during this discussion is this Banding is something that has been done before (and still is).....it's NOT cosmic by any means as a tangable concept.

So to wrap it all up for you......UPS's Fleet/Types (which was the key point in the discussion concerning Banding Structure between CAL/UAL NC's/MECs) is Banded together completely....in their case it happens to be ALL Types. Just to be clear as was cited above by you, their CBA was ratified by the Pilot Group outside of any kind of BK proceedings......So yes, it has happened before outside of what you claim (BK).

Beyond that, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree and drink beers at a later date Joe As fate would have it, the WX is bad this morning, thus CX'ing my "tee time". Hitting plan "B", paddling out for a session to make the best of 2-3ft waves with poor shape!

Cheers brother...

SC

Coto Pilot

I call BS on this one SoCal. When all aircraft types pay the same it isn't banding, it is paying to seniority.

SoCalGuy

Oh yeah...."your right" Coto.

Since when is putting multiple a/c (or an entire fleet per the above example) on a single tier is NOT Banding?? (Like type, or not such as UPS does system wide, or as DAL does with they B747/B777)

I guess when WM scoffed at the idea of doing just that (B777 & B747), she stated that UAL was NOT onboard with 'BANDING' those a/c together. If that's NOT Banding, then what is she referring too???

Call it what you want, but a "fact is a fact". Please keep digging sir.

Flyguppy

Looking like you were wrong, bub.