I'm certain that ship has sailed. Why would this combined pilot group spend negotiating capital to buy-out guys who have to leave anyway. By the time any TA is presented, there will be less than a year to go before the age 65 stagnation breaks free. We've endured 4 years, what's one more?

The bell curve of age distribution peaks with 1963 DOB pilots whom should see there is no benefit over the life of the next contract to buy-out the Sr. guys who are retiring anyway.

Where have CAL FAs been given major pay cuts? Where have their hours been capped? Where is it said that CAL FAs are now doing the rotating reserve thing? Where has ONE THING CHANGED TODAY THAT WASN'T IN PLACE YESTERDAY?

The contracts are in place and they will stay in place while a new contract is negotiated for the combined FA group. The AFA will do well to actually listen to ALL of their members. Even some of their own voted for the IAM because they liked the idea of flexible flying w/ no caps as an example. The AFA is going to have to earn the trust of a lot of FAs and they won't just be able to say this is our contract and work rules that we are going to use so all we are going for are pay raises.

Why is it that I run into people who believe voting for one union or the other mean the other group was going to have the other's contract imposed on them? All it was was a union representational vote not a CBA ratification vote.

Not really the same thing: There are no involuntary FA furloughs at UA. The furloughees are, in some cases, very senior flight attendants. AFA wants to protect the seniority rights of their members. Perfectly appropriate and we would accept nothing less. AFA also said that there is time to work out a JCBA and make this a moot subject. Also correct. If this were an involuntary furlough of the most junior FA's, I'm sure AFA's stance would be different.

There's a whole lot of skullduggery here that needs to be considered: This subject was broached prematurely by management to disadvantage AFA in the election. And then they tried to manipulate the election results by announcing an FA new hire program less than a week before the polls closed. They couldn't wait a week?

Oh, my bad. I thought the UAL FA's were capped on their hours. Once the CAL FA's have to work under their new rules I was under the impression they wouldn't be able to fly 100+ hours a month, therefore I THOUGHT many might take some large financial hits (I haven't talked to a SINGLE UAL FA that wants CALs workrules and flexibility). And I guess going DOH isn't going to affect many CAL FA's? My bad again. I guess pretty much getting stapled to the bottom is good in your opinion. Sorry, I'll keep my opinions to myself. :rolleyes:

Well, again, nothing changes for CAL flight attendants until a new contract is negotiated, so you don't yet have any idea what is going to change for them. Stapled to the bottom? I know what you are trying to say, but that is needlessly inflammatory. DOH is not stapled. Do you think the SLI would have gone differently if IAM had won?

I personally don't want my FA's flying over 100 hours a month for safety and fatigue reasons.

Lastly, I'm guessing that there will be few UAL FA's that end up wanting to transfer to IAH, CLE, or EWR, so I'm not sure the seniority issue will be as great as you suggest

The majority of CAL's FA's are EXTREMELY junior, so how do you figure that DOH is going to be fair for them? They are, for the most part, going to get hosed bigtime. A "partial" integration would be better by far than just a "DOH". An FA flying over 100 hours a month at CAL is totally different than us and what we do up front. They are up moving around, and get paid differently than we do, so the 100+ hours a month for them isn't as bad as it sounds. And I think their will be a whole lot more moving around in the NYC area than you think too.........but maybe I'll be wrong and they'll all be happy as can be. Heck, I've been wrong before and I'm sure I'll be wrong again...........:p

When you consider the sit times built in to the skeds, I'm amazed that they get 100 hours. They must NEVER get home. F/As have families too, this job ought to recognize that.

Flying more to make more is simply an idiotic gesture when you are being paid slave wages. This company can afford to pay the worker bees a reasonable living wage so we don't HAVE to spend 300 hours a month away from home. This job sucks the life out of you as it is, why give them 20-22 days a month so that you can afford to buy decent beer?

NO ONE who holds a line should have to work more than 15 days to get 82-85 hours. FA OR PILOT.

Duty and trip rigs. Decent pay. Anything else is a no vote.

CAL FAs are paid considerably more than UAL's. If anything, it's UAL's FAs that are getting the slave wages.

The people getting 100+ hrs are doing 3 PVGS and a TLV. It's 110hrs and 18 days off. Or they do Caribbean turns (9-10hrs). 10 of those and there's 100hrs and 20-21 days off a month.

Some of their domestic trips are built to the same efficiencies (27hr 3days).

Some of them do more brutal line modifications (coming in from DEL at 5am and leaving for TLV at 10pm as an example), but again, that isn't built by the company and for a FA to pick up that extra flying another FA has to drop it.

What wasn't really talked about is the company CANNOT build lines like that. It is done through FAs advertising their trips and other FAs picking them up.

International id's don't have that sit time.

We have one FA who is pretty well known throught CAL. He doesn't need the money, but is a work-a-holic. 240+ hours a month........EVERY month. From what I've heard, he's the highest paid FA in the world. (Well over $12,000 a month). He's never tired, always has a smile on his face, has an incredible work ethic, and hasn't done an overnight in over 20 years. He lives 15 mins from the airport, has a couple of side businesses, and will bend over backwards to help you out. He does LAX/MEX/SFO/LAS turns all month. We don't have many FA's like him, but their are a few.............and they are damn good FA's. As long as no one is furloughed, I really could care less how many hours they fly..........oh, and he TAKES GREAT CARE OF THE PIT. :)