The 59XX pairings are relief FO positions

So then I understand.... 737 in LAX will not fly Hawaii after JAN because the new flying rigs?

Don't think that's true. What will stop is the 11 hour turns due to no rest seat. Guess more layovers in Hawaii.

I have not looked at the new rest/duty rigs. I flew the 757 from LAX to the islands for a year on the bankruptcy contract, and it just about killed me. 12 days off and 72 hours. But now we get a 5 hour look back. So, 15 hours makes for more time off or more money. Nice choice. I hope it stays that way.

Some of the HI flying was so unproductive I used to cover the trips on reserve...from IAD. Guys would bid away from them in order to make some money flying elsewhere. Never understood how we allowed that rig to vaporize.

The guppy guys refer to Hawaii flying as doing a "crossing"

It is the longest open ocean segment in the world with no divert options.

No. That is a long told myth. There is a large hole in the middle of the Pacific that you have to circumnavigate if you are only authorized 180 minute ETOPS. If you have 300+ minute ETOPS like some 330's and 777's, that hole shrinks down to near insignifigance. Unfortunately none of our 777's have that authorization. Hence the trouble our 777's have flying to SYD.

I believe the mid and south Atlantic has a similar hole. You can do it with 180 minute ETOPS, but you fly a longer and inefficient circuitous route.

The EWR girls call flying to Dublin a and Scotland a "crossing". SFO and LAX are longer from EWR. But hey, they are overwater and ETOPS. Thank god they are in a real airplane like a 757, if they were in a guppy they would be running the APU the whole time.

Flamesuit on. LOL

Sorry dude, west coast to HI is the longest ETOPS segment in the world, no options, no alternates. The only other region that I know that comes close is New Zealand to Antarctica, specifically McMurdo, and that is not flown commercially.

The Pacific, even in the remotest regions, has legions of small islands and atolls that have runways and work as emergency diverts. You are still dispatched ETOPS for these areas as they may not be suitable.

HI islands is still the design and certification point. The longer ETOPS rules only enable more efficient routings in the other regions of the Pacific--for that matter the Atlantic too.

Sorry Dave, there is a huge whole in the central Pacific. You can avoid it and fly around it (wasting gas and time) and maintain 180 ETOPS, but you cannot fly through it. I believe there are few other places as well. You can fly a longer route, and maintain 180, but it costs you a lot of time and gas.

If 180 was the longest, why would Boeing and Airbus go to the trouble of certifying (and trying in the 787) their aircraft for 300+ minute ETOPS, if 180 was enough?

West Coast to Hawaii being the longest is a myth, and always has been. Nobody thought about the others before because those routes were exclusively flown by 747's.

I will do some research and post a link.