Early Retirement Number guesses?
 

What is the consensus number leaving early April-June? Not including mandatory retirements.

Since I'm the realist here. lol-

I'm going to guess less than the numbers people are wishing for on the line. (80-100 prints ordered.)

My guess is 40-50.

I was told in November they had already ordered 92 cakes for April 2. This from a training guy that's friends with the Flight Ops ladies at the ASC. Hope he's right.

Do they allow family into the ASC for the final flight celebration? I saw all the prints out there getting signed... just wondering.


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80+..........guess only.

Apr-Jun 100+

Help me out with these numbers. Are these early retirements not yet announced, or ones already planned? Thank you!

Early outs...second half of contract signing bonus is 1 April and a fair number of 88-90 hires have had their fill.

Thank you!

So they announce on April 1st that they are retiring, and then retire on a certain date? Or are they done right away?

They simply have to be on property 1 Apr to get the bonus.

Some folks probably dropped retirement papers for 2 Apr within days of the TA being ratified.

My guess is 71!

Up to the individual. One captain called in retired for his trip and was done right then. No fini flight, cake or anything.

Another was in sim for a check, decided he was done, and told the instructor to take the sim off motion he was leaving.

25 in April, 43 by June

Yes, if in SDF, they take them out to the ramp, watch them land and taxi including the fire truck water show, then let them on the plane before going back to ASC for a farewell.

That's a very nice thing that UPS does for the retiring pilot and his/her family. I'm sure they will all remember that for a long, long time.

For the night flying capts retiring, I don't think they offer the firehose arches. There is the cake, but most of the pilots there aren't going to wait around unless they have a strong personal connection...they will head off to the sleep rooms to try and make it through the west coast outbound.

Here's the way I see it.

We will see the retirements in three waves. The first will be the guys waiting for the bonus to retire and that's 4/1/17. The next wave occurs through the late summer as the 1988 hires hit 30 years of service. 1/1/18 is the third wave.

Retirees on 1/1/18 will get their sick bank and 5 weeks of vacation paid out and that's over $100,000.

5 weeks of vacation equals 175 hours times 300 and a full Vick bank is 158 hours times $300.

^^^^^^^This!

Are these retirement numbers already factored into the hiring of 300 this year?

Spot on except the hourly rate will be $309 on 1/1/18. And doesn't the sick bank go up to 168 by then as well?

Yes...along with mandatory retirements, contractual changes that require additional staffing, and beginning to staff the -8s.

That said, if the actual number of early outs exceeds projections, that'll drive additional hiring beyond the 301 original vacancies.

Sounds good!

The sick bank would be 158 if you elect to not increase it. However, your SICK CHECK if full, would be another 71 hours!

All together, you should have: sick check, sick bank and vacation.

One strategy to maximize money, not days off would be to retire Feb 7th. Take OCV money(option A) the first 5 weeks of the year! Now, you are talking about leave Feb 7th if you sick bank was full with a YTD check over 500 hours plus B fund contributions. And you could have even added money to your 401K.

Good point. That's more like $120k counting the B plan contributions.

In any case I expect to see another retirement push next Jan/Feb.

-Retirees on 1/1/18 will get their sick bank and 5 weeks of vacation paid out and that's over $100,000.

????

I agree with the Sick Bank. But not sure of someone retiring on the 1st getting 5 weeks of vacation pay?

Wouldn't the person have to bid all of his 2018 vacation weeks in jan-feb. Then stay on to get the pay through mid-Feb. Then retire?

9.A.1.g:
All unused sick leave accumulated will be paid to a crewmember when he resigns/retires.


11.B.13:
A crewmember reaching a mandatory retirement age or who is otherwise retiring, may request that he receive pay-in-lieu of vacation, for all accrued and unused vacation credit, in his final paycheck. His request must be received prior to the bid of the next year's vacations and must be in writing.

11.E.4:
When a crewmember is furloughed, retires, or resigns, he shall be paid the prorated vacation pay he has earned. A crewmember discharged for just cause shall not be paid his accrued vacation. A crewmember on a leave of absence may utilize vacation consistent with Article 9. A furloughed crewmember's vacation credit will begin accruing upon his return to active service.

Nice! Is the unused vacation pay at 3 hours per vacation day, or 5 hours per vacation day?

The only references to being paid 5 hours per day for unused vacation are under the OCV and BV sections...otherwise the daily contract rate for unused vacation is 3 hours per day.

This is correct if you want 5 hours per day you need to bid it and use OCV. If you retire with unused sick days it will be at 3 hours a day.

I think that the other key to rewiring after January 1 is that you will be getting whatever you get, sick, vacation, etc, in a lower tax rate year than if you take it the same year that you are working in.

Any idea on how BV days would pay out if you bid those, then decided to retire before using them in the upcoming year? 5 hours or 3 hours payout?

11.G.4.c:

All unused BV days at end of vacation year will be paid to the crewmember by February 15th of the next year. The hours will be paid out at the crewmember’s hourly rate as of December 31st of the prior year. Each unused day will be worth 5:00 hours.

Hmmm. Whats ur hourly rate if retired? $0?

The language in this section would suggest that it applies to an active pilot that does not use their BV days in the year.

Since they will not be paid until Feb of the following year, how could this apply to a retirement ?

I doubt that it would.

The language as written does not specify active pilots, though it is certainly reasonable to assume that based on context.

Combine 11.G.4.c with 11.E.4 and there's a pretty compelling argument to be made that unused BV days would be paid to a retiree at 5hr/day.

But of course...the EB, BM, Legal/Grievance staff and almost certainly UPS Labor may disagree with this APC forum lawyer's opinion :D

It is a worthy question for somebody to run up the flagpole to the EB, either directly or via the B&G.

Agreed.

Here's another dilemma. I understand that it could be beneficial to have an upcoming retiree take as much VAC as BV days. And 5 hours of pay vs 3 hours of pay would certainly provide one the finincial incentive to do just that.

But the total number of BV days chosen does allow the company to reduce VAC weeks for bid ... think less VAC weeks available for bid in the popular summer months.

Hmmm ... thoughts ?

Bid it as early in the year as possible and the sell it back at 5 hrs

Looks like 2/16 would be a good day to retire if you banked vacation days and wanted it paid out st 5 hours per day. That's potentially 175 hours at @ $310 per hour next February.

I don't believe the 'early retirements' will be substantial at all. This is my 3rd contract with UPS, every time the old guys say the same thing, "if the A Plan increases I'm out of here". I think 3 guys left early in 2006.
Many of these old guys don't have the necessary hobbies to retire early and/or are greedy. They love the money more than living a longer life.

Not accurate.....they'd only get the 175 hours of pay for their 5 weeks of vacation (as part of your $100,000 payout) IF they actually flew their trips. Won't be a mass exit on 1/1/18.

You can only "sell it back" at 5 hours per day if you actually fly your line as is. Wouldn't be leaving early in that case....