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-   -   Reserve Extensions (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/ups/108394-reserve-extensions.html)

SaltyDog 09-26-2017 05:50 AM

It was a trade and UPS is finding benefits.
Unpopular as it is, their are IPA benefits as noted. One not often stated, If not extended, 100% of the commuting pilots sitting RSV in ANC or ONT, MIA or SDF can leave 24 hours earlier than on the 2006 contract.
Most pilots are not actually extended, so most actually get the extra day off and home 24 hours earlier than 2006 contract. If extended, better benefits than 2006 contract
Regarding planning a vital appointment on the first day off after a reserve period, in all previous contracts, one could be extended for a few reasons such as weather or maintenance issues. Still can. still bid reserve occasionally ( bid for days off usually) and have in my entire career never lost sight of the fact that one can go into days off so never scheduled doctors appointments etc on first day off after block of reserve since in all contracts was a possibility of me not being at the appointment. I get the frustration but am aware of the background in our contract history (16 days reserve etc). Perhaps reduced on contract 2021

FTFF 09-26-2017 07:19 AM

I'm not a fan of this contract giveback but on a SYSTEM WIDE BASIS , it isn't occurring at a such a frequency that we need to start losing our $hit over it. I've been extended more as a line holder than any of the guys I know who bid reserve. Yeah, I'm aware some guys are getting the shaft. As far as not being guaranteed off the day following an assignment, be it a reserve block or a line pairing, welcome to flying for a living.

CactusCrew 09-26-2017 07:32 AM


Originally Posted by Taildragger46 (Post 2436110)
What does LAP mean? Also I heard from my buddy that these extensions can be very lucrative for a guy in his second year and higher. What's the pay structure when you get extended?

LAP = Late Arrival Pay

It can be lucrative on the international trips. My experience domestically, getting home late isn't worth the extra coin that LAP provides. That's just me.

Or I got screwed on a pay calculation in their favor, imagine that ? !

Busflyer 09-26-2017 12:49 PM


Originally Posted by Taildragger46 (Post 2436110)
What does LAP mean? Also I heard from my buddy that these extensions can be very lucrative for a guy in his second year and higher. What's the pay structure when you get extended?

Pay is figured as a new trip beginning at the end of your original trip. Usually that will be on the trip rig. If you get back 30 hours late, it'd be 30/3.75 for a credit of 8 hours. After that a penalty of 150% is added so in total you'd get paid 20 hours for getting home 30 hours late.

FTFF 09-26-2017 01:37 PM


Originally Posted by Busflyer (Post 2436345)
Pay is figured as a new trip beginning at the end of your original trip. Usually that will be on the trip rig. If you get back 30 hours late, it'd be 30/3.75 for a credit of 8 hours. After that a penalty of 150% is added so in total you'd get paid 20 hours for getting home 30 hours late.

And if they are commercialing you back to domicile you can deviate and potentially get home close to when you were originally supposed to - It can be an awesome thing. Or it could work the other way too: get back to domicile late and over the weekend finding yourself with no good options to get home (if a commuter).

Airbum 09-27-2017 04:52 AM


Originally Posted by Busflyer (Post 2436345)
Pay is figured as a new trip beginning at the end of your original trip. Usually that will be on the trip rig. If you get back 30 hours late, it'd be 30/3.75 for a credit of 8 hours. After that a penalty of 150% is added so in total you'd get paid 20 hours for getting home 30 hours late.

This would apply ONLY to domestic trips late if I am correct.

A international trip would pay 8x1.5 for 12 hours of pay for the late arrival. A 4 hour pay penalty for your 30 hours TAFB forced overtime into a day off.

Swedish Blender 09-27-2017 11:27 AM


Originally Posted by FTFF (Post 2436157)
I'm not a fan of this contract giveback but on a SYSTEM WIDE BASIS , it isn't occurring at a such a frequency that we need to start losing our $hit over it.

Spoken like a SDF based pilot. Nothing personal, but most Mecca based pilots don't care about the plight of the other bases until it affects them. ONT had a gripe for a long time about co-terminal shuttles. Deaf ears until SDF pilots started doing it.

whalesurfer 09-27-2017 01:06 PM


Originally Posted by Swedish Blender (Post 2436956)
Spoken like a SDF based pilot. Nothing personal, but most Mecca based pilots don't care about the plight of the other bases until it affects them. ONT had a gripe for a long time about co-terminal shuttles. Deaf ears until SDF pilots started doing it.

Couldn't agree more.

FTFF 09-28-2017 06:34 AM


Originally Posted by Swedish Blender (Post 2436956)
Spoken like a SDF based pilot. Nothing personal, but most Mecca based pilots don't care about the plight of the other bases until it affects them. ONT had a gripe for a long time about co-terminal shuttles. Deaf ears until SDF pilots started doing it.

A little hypocritical - plenty of issues idiosyncratic to SDF, and all bases for that matter, that are irrelevant to people based elsewhere. As I said, I'm not a fan of this deal but at the same time a contract is a give and take and this was a give. And is it really a give for you guys doing RSV up there? What changed in practice? Same ship but now you get LAP, no? Plus, it's only due to staffing shortages so I'm sure it will start to bounce around the system and us SDF folk will get our karma. Regardless, no one is forcing you to bid reserve, fly the whale, or be ANC based, that's probably why it might be falling on deaf ears. But I do feel for you guys, never good when good things come to an end - pilot life.

Swedish Blender 09-28-2017 08:35 AM


Originally Posted by FTFF (Post 2437426)
And is it really a give for you guys doing RSV up there?
Yes it is. Besides the fact that it happens regularly, yesterday for example, it really becomes an issue trying to book a Jumpseat home when you get an unexpected change.

What changed in practice?

The contract. Prior, once you had about 2 days left, you were effectively done with reserve. To assign you into a day off, it had to be at least 120 TAFB upon assignment. Also, they couldn't revise your trip once you were on it to get you back late. They had to get you back.

Same ship but now you get LAP, no?
Before you got the day back if they used you which was rare. I don't know anyone who would rather have the money than the days off.

Plus, it's only due to staffing shortages so I'm sure it will start to bounce around the system and us SDF folk will get our karma.
UPS will always be short staffed. That's just a fact of life. SDF is somewhat insulated from the extensions. You would only cover CGN, ANC, and HNL for the 2 day extension. You can't go to Asia. ANC covers more cities and departures.

Regardless, no one is forcing you to bid reserve, fly the whale, or be ANC based, that's probably why it might be falling on deaf ears.
I'll be sure to tell the new hires you said they could hold lines or other bases:rolleyes:

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