I agree with this popular opinion, the leading post is spot on. I work at Brown and it is a great job. I wish those interviewing the best of luck and those waiting for The Email - patience.

Not even a whiff of Bull****s? Really?
" Fred Smith was a Marine Pilot". Really? what did he fly? How many hours did he have in it? "Everything was given to Fx Pilots by Fred" . Get the hip boots out.

Cut them some slack and don't miss the point...their focus is on the UPS info...and by "everything" he was specifically talking about facilities and amenities. He's not discounting our union's efforts.

You'd be surprised how many people don't know that although Fred flew combat hours in the OV-10 he was just a Marine FAC, not a pilot.

A new record for APC. It only took to page 5 for the poop to start being flung at one of the most well written and thought out posts I have seen on this forum.

point taken about not discounting the union's effort, after going threw the growing pains at FX, I guess I'm a little touchy and took it the wrong way.

Well to be honest the comments about FDX ALPA were rather insulting and uninformed. We have different unions with different approaches. We could take your advice on money, you guys could take ours on work rules. No body gave us anything. There have been 3 times in the last 13 years where I have sacrificed a lot of money in the name of unity. We both work at great companies, it is not because Fred likes us and likes unions.

The post would have been just as well written, and more thought out had the references to FDX stayed on your in house board.

FDXLAG...

Tell me about the negotiations for your sleep rooms...what negotiating capital was expended for those?

The question was specious because unlike ups, fdx actually treats their pilots like they are at an airline instead of a trucking company.

That was the point of the original poster on this thread who did a bang up job describing the differences.

JTF

Pilot7576

"Tell me about the negotiations for your sleep rooms...what negotiating capital was expended for those?"

Maybe if you guys had crashed as many airplanes as we have (with fatigue often being a huge factor), you would get some great sleep rooms like ours :(

Call in fatigued you will get sleep rooms and better schedules.

I think a lot of what you guys perceive as gifts from a benevolent Fred are actually results of the ALPA merger with Tigers. I know keeping them is.

Pilot7576,

The original poster did a really great job in highlighting the differences between our two companies. The one area, I feel, he didn't adequately address is in the area of something called "Good Will." It's certainly understandable however, in that UPS has never shown any "good will" toward any of its employee groups. Federal Express started out as a dream, and was perpetuated by its pilot group. That counted for a lot, and the company founder didn't forget that for many years. There was much "good will" around here for many years to come, however, that said, there was, on the part of Fred Smith, a enormous hatred for unions. Back in the day, it was "Delta plus a nickle", not because Fred wanted his pilots to be the highest paid in the industry, but mainly because he wanted them to not unionize.

Over the years FedEx has become less like a large family and more like a business, and it was at that time when we unionized. Fred hated it. The rest of the employees felt the same, but we were on our way. We went from a Flight Advisory Board, which was a group of pilots who were allowed input into the operation of the company, to a union, inheriting much of the work rules and other perks that came from the time of the FAB and of course the "good will." We built what we have now from those beginnings, fighting the company all the way. However, by then we were a truly divided group, because those at the top of the seniority pole had a whole different perspective than did those in the middle or at the bottom. Unfortunately, it remains close to that today, however the view is getting more singular for the overall group, mainly because of some of the bone-headed things that the company has done.

It was a lot different for you guys at UPS, because you built an flying operation with guys who were given nothing. No amenities, no decent facilities, no decent pay, etc. The view from your totem pole was singular, regardless of what seat you sat in or where you were on the seniority ladder. In effect, each and every one of you guys were getting screwed by UPS. That's why you have the solid union you have today. With us at purple, it's been a very different journey.