Tanker-driver

JetBlue passengers endure scary emergency landing - CNN.com

Second time in the last couple of months for JB. Cellphone video shows the cabin filled with smoke after the incident.

evamodel00

So does it sound like 2 separate issues that happened here or would the smoke-filled cabin somehow be related to a blown engine?

FlyJSH

Thank heaven everyone took the time to get the camera out and film the events... rather than paying attention to the crew.

Cycle Pilot

I'm still trying to figure out why or how the crew deployed the O2 masks. I'm wondering if they tried to evacuate the smoke and accidentally climbed the cabin above 14,000?

sailingfun

It grew so thick that passengers could no longer see the people seated next to them, said passenger Jonathon Hubbard.
West realized he would have a hard time breathing soon, but oxygen masks did not drop down, he said.
So, flight attendants went around deploying them by hand.


Sounds like the JB flight attendants might need a bit more training.

sandlapper223

Yes they do need more training. The manual deployment tool that FA's carry is intended to be used to deploy masks on the passenger service units that fail to deploy during activation. They ARE NOT to be used for FA manual mask deployment strategies because they want to or especially during smoke or fumes conditions (they will not help anyway).

In addition, the chemical reaction creates heat and fumes - I wouldn't be surprised if some of the smoke seen on the video was a result of that.

Engines can and do fail. Smoke and fumes will enter the cabin and cause chaos in the cabin until professional flight attendants step up and take control. This is what they preach all about right? "We are here to keep your A$$ safe, not kiss it" I hear over and over. So I hope this was not the case - if so, there will be some explaining to do.

Of course, passengers often panic- they know the masks are up there - and start a cascade of ripping them down. But again, the FA's need to take control.

Passenger masks that are deployed during a real fire - smoke or fumes event - is dangerous and can turn an urgent situation into a disaster.

sandlapper223

And further, while I'm Monday morning quarterbacking, is it necessary to dump 140-ish passengers on the runway? Obviously I wasn't there, but assuming the cabin atmosphere is livable, and the failure contained, why evac on the runway? I see too much of this - from a blown tire to smoking brakes or what ever else have you.

Is this a result of our training? Every single PC or type ride is practice stop on the runway, set the parking brake, and put the FA's on alert for an evac. Then practice an evac. Where's the "be a captain, stay cool and using your head" procedure? People usually get hurt when you evacuate - it should be used as a last resort when lives are in imminent danger.

I'm not trying to second guess anyone here, it's just I see too many Evacs in recent times when a safe taxi back to the gate may be the better plan.

UAL T38 Phlyer

If the engine failure is due to a bird ingestion, or an oil seal in the compressor section, the remains of the bird or the vaporized oil will come off in the bleed air and go in the packs/cabin.

This (oil seal) happened to an RJ last year on short final at Denver. Smoke was so bad, the crew couldn't see the instruments. They broke out at 100 ft and managed to land without further incident. Very lucky; weather was at minimums and they were inside the marker when it blew.

People in back suffered a lot of vapor inhalation.

If the FAs in this JB scenario called and said "We can't breathe!!", the crew could drop the masks with a switch.

sandlapper223

This is my point. Passenger oxygen masks are not designed nor intended for smoke protection. Most SOP's clearly state to not deploy passenger masks during fire or smoke. They will not prevent the wearer from inhaling smoke and fumes, and can cause the situation to become worse.

The best a crew can do is keep the passengers calm and perform the smoke removal procedure if it becomes the biggest threat. If the bleed from the engine isnt contained by pushing the fire handle or pack is belching toxic fumes - the packs and bleeds need selected off and open the ram air and raise the cabin. Deploying 140 passenger masks with chem generators isn't going to do diddly squat.

sailingfun

Why? It would not help them breath. It's a very low mix of O2 with ambient air on those masks. With the cabin below 14 k and going down there is no need.