Originally Posted by
aa73
EVERY arbitrator figures in career expectations when deciding an integration.
First of all, you didn't own any seat. Neither did I. AMR owned it. So lose your holier than thou attitude about what you "owned" and what you didn't. You didn't own squat, and neither did I.
Second of all, I am exactly 2000 #s from CA upgrade. Who gives a crap? Estimated CA upgrade shouldn't figure into career expectations at all: it changes on a whim and you know it. You could have been a 25 year CA at TWA... what if your airline was downsizing and furloughing while AA was growing and hiring? What should be done then - give you a CA seat at AA and furlough a native? You see, that's career expectations for you. Here is the bottom FACTUAL line, ER: AA today bears no resemblance whatsoever to TWA in 2001. Way ahead on size, financials, routes, fleet expansion, retirements... I could go on and on.
Nope - not one comparison at all. TWA was practically a domestic airline at time of asset acquisition with a few Carib and Europe routes. South America? NONE. Asia? NONE. Far East? NONE. Widebodies? a few 762s and 763s. 777s? NONE. If AMR were that size today as well, I would gladly hand you this argument and say you are 100% right. But that ain't the case and you know it. AA/US is a complete merger of one large airline and one extremely large airline - in fact it is USAir who needs AA more than AA needs USAir.
The relative SLIs at DL/NW and UA/CO weren't crafted with 'career expectations', just fair & equitable integration of pilots flying like-sized equipment---and neutral, binding 3rd-party arbitration. US/HP was
quite different, but there is no doubting the TWA/AA integration was completely one-sided, inequitable and void of
any arbitrated decision (
which APA fought long and hard to deny TWA pilots) and resulted in the wholesale destruction of most of TWA's 2400 pilots and their future careers. Only 495 were left at AA after furloughs, FERBs and attrition.
I didn't own any seat? So it's okay for you to replace me on TWA jets, flying TWA routes out of TWA hubs with TWA Captains? Remember your sentence above if US staples you and you get furloughed/displaced. You'll feel exactly the same, my friend.
As far as upgrading, it is very hard to predict the future. If AA down-sizes, comes out of Chapter 11 and either merges or is bought-out, your future upgrade potential will change as well. I take your "
AA today bears no resemblance whatsoever to TWA in 2001. Way ahead on size, financials, routes, fleet expansion, retirements... " to mean that AA is better, AA pilots are more entitled and AA pilots deserve more than TWA, TWA pilots or TWA employees did in 2001. Do I have that right? It doesn't change one very important thing:
AA IS BANKRUPT.
Someone else will be deciding your collective futures---either the bankruptcy court, the judge or another airline or even another pilot union. You may think AA is in a better position than TWA was in '01, and BTW your retirements comment was incorrect (TWA had greater % of retirements), but AA is still not in control of its future.
One last retort: your description of TWA being a domestic airline?
"TWA was practically a domestic airline at time of asset acquisition with a few Carib and Europe routes. South America? NONE. Asia? NONE. Far East? NONE. Widebodies? a few 762s and 763s. 777s? NONE."
Do you realize you just described
USAirways perfectly (substitute A330s for 763s)? Look at the questions above. One very important distinction, however; this time the 'domestic' airline will be buying AA, not the other way around. We'll see how any future integration goes after AA and their 'unions' so dispicably treated employees from most airlines they acquired in the past. Turnabout is fair play.