Quote:
Assuming for a moment that you are talking about me please allow me to clear up a few items.
My name is Joe Peck. I live in NY and fly out of IAD and work for UAL. I like to think I'm a reasonable man, and I apologize if my comments on your forum angered you, however, I would like to disagree with your contention that I am "uninformed". I read the award many times over, and I read the dissent as well, and then I scoured the boards to try and understand the different sides opinions. All that, I did prior to posting my question. I stand by my analysis that most independent observers with whom I have spoken feel that it was a mistake for USAir to not accept the ISL as handed down. I am not saying I agree with the decision; I am saying failing to accept the decision was a practical and legal mistake that has cost the pilots of USAir tremendously in terms of financial loss and QOL.
Anyways, don't know if that makes any difference to you, but there it is. Again, please accept my apologies if my short interference on the forum angered you.
Joe
Joe,Originally Posted by Sunvox
R,Assuming for a moment that you are talking about me please allow me to clear up a few items.
My name is Joe Peck. I live in NY and fly out of IAD and work for UAL. I like to think I'm a reasonable man, and I apologize if my comments on your forum angered you, however, I would like to disagree with your contention that I am "uninformed". I read the award many times over, and I read the dissent as well, and then I scoured the boards to try and understand the different sides opinions. All that, I did prior to posting my question. I stand by my analysis that most independent observers with whom I have spoken feel that it was a mistake for USAir to not accept the ISL as handed down. I am not saying I agree with the decision; I am saying failing to accept the decision was a practical and legal mistake that has cost the pilots of USAir tremendously in terms of financial loss and QOL.
Anyways, don't know if that makes any difference to you, but there it is. Again, please accept my apologies if my short interference on the forum angered you.
Joe
On the US forum you wrote:
"I have read the Nic and the DAL/NWA award from cover to cover many times over in an attempt to understand what is likely to happen to me now, and long story short you guys at east are smokin' crack. Just look at the ludicrous situation you have put yourself in now. You are and have been the lowest paid legacy pilots for years. Talk about cuttin' off your nose to spite your face."
How could anyone take offense at that?
I asked you a simple question, that despite your "knowledge" of our situation you could not answer. That was, "What lousy contract should the east pilots have accepted in order to cement the west pilots windfall?" I asked that because that was what we were facing. You can read the Nicolau award all you want, but without reading and understanding a few other things, you cannot UNDERSTAND. Our TA called for a JCBA before a SLI could be used. The contract that we were being offered, the Kirby proposal stunk. As I said, it wasn't as if we had a DL contract on the table for the taking. So had we not "cut off our nose to spite our face" we would have had a lousy contract for another 10 years or so AND a lousy SLI.
The fact that our TA allowed this to happen is what is lost on so many people despite the fact that it led to a dramatic overhaul in ALPA merger policy and the way arbitration are now handled. Even if the east pilots had not formed USAPA they would have been able to, and I firmly believe they would have, prevent the Nicolau from being implemented unchanged.
The real mistake in our situation was the failure of both sides to come to a solution other than the one that was taken. I thought we should have stayed in ALPA(I hated ALPA, but didn't think it was the time to leave with the mess at hand) followed the TA and come up with a solution. We didn't and then the west pilots filed a premature DFR suit that has left us tied up in court until this day (another point lost on some many guys that are outside our situation).
Anyway, little applies to you guys but I will give both sides some advice. Listen to your advisers. Don't P.O. a judge or arbitrator. Don't make it personal-a SLI is business but if you make it personal bad feelings will linger for decades and cost you way down the road. The US east pilots are still fighting battles that were spawned with PI/US.
Apology accepted and again, good luck to you guys.