That question is hard to answer. Noone knows future upgrade times. And past upgrade times have little to do with future upgrade times. Envoy has more guaranteed movement via flow. They also have more experienced pilots (more likely to get a job offer.) But current upgrade time is 8 years. PSA has less movement and 1000 guys hired in the last 2 years. With true upgrade of about 2 years. Which may start moving to 5 years. Doug wants flow to be 10.