Well said. I'm not naïve to think we won't give the co. a few things but it clearly has to be a big win for us. We all must realize that the cards (RLA etc) are stacked against us in negotiations. also, the company must be able to "spin" this and show some gains. I've always thought we should agree to "soft" money like, training and vacation pay, per diem, DC money etc. so the payrate doesn't seem too big. All that stuff is still real money to us. Oh and a 6th week of vacation like we used to have would be nice too!