Originally Posted by Packer Backer
You seem to dislike the fact that a pilot is not physically "connected" to the elevator or ailerons. Is this true? If so, what do you feel about the fact that the 777, and soon the 787, will also not be connected directly to the controls? Or is it the fact that the Airbus computers "limit" your envelope?
Personally I liked the fact that my envelope was limited. It meant that if I got a GPWS, I could pull back on the stick as hard as I could and the Airplane would give me the max it could, just shy of snapping off the wings. In a Boeing, since I don't have a g-meter on my butt, I would probably tend to be more conservative with pull up because the fear of snapping a wing would be on my mind.
I'm kinda enjoying this thread. I've heard pilots for years say that they hate Airbus. But when pressed they admit that they had never flown one and they could never explain WHY they really didn't like them.
Packer Backer: Your information on the 777 is incorrect. Yes it is a FBW aircraft, but Boeing engineers kept this:
Mechanical Backup
In the unlikely event of a complete electrical system shut–down, cables from the flight deck to the stabilizer and selected spoilers allow the pilot to fly straight and level until the electrical system is restarted. Spoilers 4 and 11 are mechanically controlled through a cable from the control wheel. The alternate pitch trim levers are linked to the stabilizer trim control modules (STCM) via control cables, and then mechanically to the stabilizer.
In regards to envelope limitation the crux of the argument is highlighted in red.
The flight envelope protection system reduces the possibility of inadvertently
exceeding the airplane's flight envelope. The flight envelope protection system
provides crew awareness of envelope margins through tactile, aural, and visual cues.
The protection functions do not reduce pilot control authority.
With regards to the wings snapping off in an aggressive GPWS avoidance manuever, that my be the case with an Airbus ( we've seen the paper game Airbus will play with the A380 to get it certified after failing to make 1.5 ultimate load ), but rest assured a Boeing's wings will not snap off if you go slightly over 3.75Gs. They may be deformed a little, but the airplane will safely make it back to a landing. Remember the CAL 747 that did a one turn spin off of SFO ? Slight bending of the structure, but not much damage beyond that.
I don't hate Airbus, I hate their design philosophy. Boeing design philosophy keeps the pilot in the loop. Here is another example:
Control in the pitch axis is accomplished through a “maneuver
demand” control law
modified to include conventional speed stability. With the “maneuver demand” control law, the pilot’s column inputs specify a blend of pitch rate and “g” force that the PFCs accomplish by moving the elevator and stabilizer. The major advantage of using a maneuver demand control law is that conventional pitch handling characteristics, which increase pilot workload, can be minimized.
This makes the airplane easier to fly and provides a smoother ride for passengers.
To minimize the nuisance conventional characteristics, the control law generates an elevator command which duplicates the normal pilot response in a conventional airplane. For thrust changes and turbulence, the PFCs react to the initial airplane pitch changes and automatically counter with elevator commands so the pitch attitude and flight path remain relatively constant. For flap and speedbrake configuration changes, the PFCs use the flap position and speedbrake lever position to determine the elevator command required to minimize the airplane response. The elevator command smoothly changes the airplane pitch attitude so the flight path remains constant. For banked turns the control law uses airplane bank angle to determine the elevator command required to minimize the airplane pitch-down due to the bank angle.
While these conventional handling characteristics are countered by the maneuver demand control law, the conventional characteristic of “speed stability” has been retained. The “speed stability” aspect of the pitch control law modifies the maneuver demand effect by changing the airplane pitch attitude (and therefore flight path) in response to deviations in airspeed from the trimmed airspeed. This feature duplicates conventional airplane speed stability
by providing the pilot with column force cues associated with maintaining the original flight path. As on a conventional airplane, trimming is required to reduce the column forces.
Typhoonpilot