I spent a few hours at a Part 61 club that offers flight training this Sunday. One of the instructors there essentially concluded the same as you. Instinctively, I've been increasingly 'feeling' that this is the right thing to do with one exception - Turbine Time. The first challenge will be getting to the point where I am VLJ insurable in the eyes of the underwriter.

The insurance company seems to care mostly about my relevant turbine time as PIC. I care mostly about my relevant Multi-Engine Turbine time as PIC flying IFR in IMC, plenty of Night ops and into HDA airports. So, my standards are always going to be higher.

After the Private and Instrument Rating, what do you think about these candidates for the Multi-Engine Rating and Multi-Engine Turbine Time Building Phase:

- Cessna Conquest I 425
- Cessna Conquest II 441
- Beechcraft King Air B100
- Beechcraft King Air B200
- Piper Cheyenne (lots of variants avail)

On the used market, all of these aircraft can be found between $1mil - $375k depending on overall condition, Airframe/Cycle TT, Engine Type & TBO and Avionics installed. That will be roughly 1/10th or less of the VLJ cost. Very reasonable acquisition cost for a Time Building Platform. Ironically, from a pure cost comparison perspective, you can find a used Baron G58 within the exact same price range - just without the Turbines.

Would it be better to Time Build in the larger airframe that a Conquest, King Air or Cheyenne offers over the Baron? I'll need about 3,000+ hours in a Twin. The Conquest I or II seems like the easier transition platform of the three, just based on my research thus far.

During the Time Building Phase, I plan to treat it like a "Job" flying every day except weekends. There is plenty of IMC including rain, snow, fog, mountainous terrain and desert terrain all within that radius based on where I live - including plenty of busy (dense) Class B.

For a 3,000 hour Multi-Engine (Turbine) Time Building Phase, the hourly breakdown looks like this:

3,000+ hours / 36 months = 83 hours per Month
83 hours / 4 weeks = 21 hours per Week
21 hours / 5 days = 4 hours per Day

- 2 hour outbound leg plus 2 hour inbound leg per day
- 1hr flight planning
- 1hr commute to and from airport each day
- 15-40 minute pre-flight (including fuel order and/or light maint if nec
- 1hr reserve (max) for IFR departure delay

I've seen pilots waiting 43 minutes on the ground at my airport before getting their IFR departure clearance. I've seen some of them request taxi back to ramp to shut down engines and wait for IFR clearance. And, I've seen some dump the IFR departure in favor of a VFR departure to file IFR on top. So, that's why I use a 1hr max delay. If I don't need it, fine.

That's about an 8hr day total, or a full-time job. There may be weeks were I need to cut that 8hr work day in half or even down to one quarter, but I will simply make up for it along the way at some point during that year by flying more hours when I can. This gives me 3,000+hrs PIC Multi-Engine Turbine Prop.

From that point: How long do I spend with a Mentor after OEM VLJ Transition Training and Type Rating? 10hrs, 20hrs, 30hrs Mentor flying? What's appropriate with a Mentor in the VLJ before going true Single Pilot full-time?


I think I see where you're coming from now. That's the exact opposite approach. It sounds like you see the Baron as a basic Multi-Engine Instrument Twin Platform so to speak. Turbines are not really emphasized here at all. You want me flat out bored in the Baron, which really means Highly Proficient in the Baron as a Multi-Engine Instrument platform, then shift gears to the VLJ with Mentor. Hmmmm. That's interesting.

The one problem is that most of the low time Barons I've looked at online price out between $1.5mln down to $500k without damage history and many having G1000. That's about where you will find mid to high time Conquest I or II with mid-level Glass (GNS530, etc.) and no damage history. The King Airs are simply more expensive and typically come with less Glass at the same price range - those airframes are typically higher time with older OEM dates. The Cheyennes seem to fit the Conquest II used price model and sometimes the King Air B100 used price model for similar avionics on-board.

So, if we're basically talking the same money - would you prefer the larger airframe of something like the Conquest II over the Baron - including the differences in ownership experience between the two - one being turbine and the other normally aspirated?



I especially like the part about having someone thrash you in the sim and exposing weaknesses until you become a tough nut to crack, then switching seats with the Mentor. Very interesting. Thanks.

Your method/approach to all this seems intuitive, safe, practical, seamless and progressive. I rather like it. The hang-up I have is with the Baron cost factor. It can be made identical to a Turbine Prop. So, why not just grab the Turbine Time while I'm at it, following your method/approach?

Besides, your approach allows me to order the darn thing within the next 6 months, as manufacturing time could take 9 months to over 1 year - depending on CJ4 or Phenom 300.



[With a Mentor in the VLJ] Very interesting, indeed. Thanks. This is very helpful info. Much appreciated.