Originally Posted by
connollc View Post
I wasn't here when it happened, but in a past downturn did not the pilots give 30+% in pay cuts only to have the company file BK anyway and take more? What would you say about that in the context of “holding strong?”
What you’re saying is technically true, but let’s keep it in perspective. OTH is there value (morally or otherwise) in negotiating something that could mitigate furloughs. That is what we as a group will need to answer.
EDIT: the BK judge “took more”
Originally Posted by
Gone Flying
United went into BK without any cuts, both airlines had similar contracts in 2002 timeframe UAL did not cut to avoid BK, DL did.
United came out with slightly lower rates than DL. I’m not saying we should not defend our contract, we absolutely should. I’m just saying the idea if we just “say no” to management everything will be great when we return ignores what can happen in BK.
airlinefiles.com has historical pay rates for all the legacies. for those who were not here (like me) it is truly enlightening how far we fell and how far we have come since the mid 2000s. Eg in 2006 12 year 757/767 CA pay was $155/hour at DL and $152/hour at UAL
You guys are both pretty close:
LOA 46 Effective 01 December 2004 Signed by John Malone/Gerald Grinstein
DAL Pilots take a voluntary 32% paycut to avoid BK (do it once do it right)
The company rolls into BK anyway - IMHO just as planned all along.
The company takes us to court and files an 1113 motion to basically throw out what remained of our already gutted contract. Remember we had just jointly agreed to this contract to avoid BK.
LOA 51 Effective 01 June 2006 SIgned by Lee Moak/Gerald Grinstein-
DAL Pilots take an additional voluntary 14% paycut to preserve as much of our contract as possible. We did actually preserve a bare minimum of work rules duty rigs but overall it was ugly.
Some will say LOA 51 was foolish and we should have fought. Others will say we preserved some of our work rules so it was the wise move. I was still livid that we were duped on LOA 46 and voted against LOA 51 - it was the only time in over 20 years that I voted in the minority.
The lesson here is that in volatile times all bets are off. We are in an unprecedented revenue reduction environment that is easily subject to DAL managements claim of "Things Changed." Yes, we should work with management for a furlough mitigation win-win, but lets perhaps go in with a healthy dose of skepticism and a little less gullibility. If the company decides its in their best interest to furlough - they will furlough.
Scoop