Originally Posted by
GunshipGuy
Major thread jack, but I beg to differ. I'm not a patch wearer who forgets to check all her ACMs to see if they have warheads in them or not, but I don't see any mention of a requirement for ground contact in JP 1-02 or JP 3-05 when it comes to defining DA. No disrespect to the outstanding and very impressive pave low guys we have serving, but are 53 crews now routinely getting out of their helos to hunt down the enemy? From JP 3-05:
direct action. Short-duration strikes and other small-scale offensive actions conducted as a special operation in hostile, denied, or politically sensitive environments and which employ specialized military capabilities to seize, destroy, capture, exploit, recover, or damage designated targets. Direct action differs from conventional offensive actions in the level of physical and political risk, operational techniques, and the degree of discriminate and precise use of force to achieve specific objectives.
I've seen gunships, A-10s, preds, etc, work with ground SOF on DA missions. I don't know what else you would want to call it. My point is that this is the kind of flak the pave mafia puts up to keep their boys from having to integrate (read: SF, SEALs, Rangers, etc are a different story). Eventually that line of BS that they're like SOF/conventional ground teams will no longer fly and they can catch up with the rest of the AF and learn to keep their coin purse shaving fetish in check when the women are around.
But dude..they aren't in direct contact with the enemy. That is what draws the line of women in combat. The Paves at least land, drop off the SF, and the gunner miay actually pull the trigger on a minigun on an insurgent who gets within 10m from the side of the Pave. We can talk over a beer, but due to the customer and the customer's mission..those assets - -22 and MH53 don't let women in. And to be honest I'm all for it. When I meant DA..I didnt mean DA in the sense of the JSOAC tasking it...well, sorta did....kicking doors down and shooting folks in close quarters IS what DA is...but AFSOC kinda stretched it. And women can't kick doors in and put rounds into folks in the DOD.
Anything else that flies different folks or flies higher...go for it.
and BTW....I was there in the HOA when they started the shaving crap....there were MANY women around. One was the first shaved...then the others were offended when the dudes......errr...ugh.