Originally Posted by gloopy

True, although to put it in proper perspective, CAL was offered "DAL +1%" and they swiftly rejected it. Was that because they want fatter raises than that? Probably. But a HUGE part of it was that their management's offer included DL scope, which was huge relief to CAL's industry leading scope. That is encouraging.

In any case, I don't expect LM or anyone in DALPA to come out publicly with a percentage raise or some arbitrary date adjusted for inflation, etc right now. I don't think that is smart at all. But what I do expect is certain language about the general direction of expected pay restoration and other non-negotiables. Something like this:

When our airline needed us the most, the Delta and Northwest pilots stepped up and made enormous sacrifices to save our company. We agreed to staggering pay and benefit cuts, the elimination of our pensions and draconian outsourcing of our jobs, even as we were rapidly losing them. We were told that this had to be done to save the company. Although we gave deeply, and in most cases we gave back far too much for far too long, we did save our airline. In addition to that, even while working for years under a temporary emergency contract negotiated under duress on the bankruptcy courthouse steps, we helped facilitate what many agree is one of the most successful airline mergers in history and in record time. We are now making record profits and reaping operational synergies that are the envy of the industry. As before, we remain partners in our airline's success as no one has a more vested interest in the long term success of Delta Air Lines than its over 12,000 professional pilots. As the ammendable date for our temporary and emergency bankruptcy contract, signed under extreme hardship to save the airline and then extended yet again to facilitate the merger, comes to a close in the coming years, Delta's pilots seek only to recapture significant portions of what was lost. While pay will definately go up and outsourcing will absolutely be reduced commensurate with the level of sacrifice and investment made in our airline in its hour of need and continually through the decade since, our company, its shareholders and its customers should know that the pilots of Delta Air Lines remain committed to significant yet sustainable contractual restorations that will ensure the long term success of our proud and industry leading airline.

Or something like that, whatever. The point is, there are ways to state our goals without having to worry about specific numbers or percentages over 2 years and an almost entire peer set negotiation cycle ahead of ourselves. However, there are some things that need to be said that are not only not being said, they are flat out being actively avoided and that is completely unacceptable. AA has a specific pay proposal, UCAL has a specific scope proposal, and both are industry dominating, yet we seem too timid to even dare suggest even in theory that pay will go up or, God forbid, that outsourcing will go down. If we stand for nothing, we'll fall for anything. Time to nut up. At least a little bit.