67Creek

Can someone please quote (PM if you prefer) the language in the FOM that pertains to flying for hire outside of American?

TheRaven

Commercial flying for any employer other than American Airlines or the military is not permitted.

MarineGrunt

While that is wha the FM1 says, many pilots fly as CFIs on the outside as well as some other jobs and many have been approved by their flight office. Don’t know the process or anything, I just know that some have done it.

67Creek

Thanks guys.

It's also my understanding that some fly on the outside in some limited capacity. Does the FOM have language to allow for deviation?

I'm trying to determine what would and wouldnt be blessed by the company. If the only way to do it is to lie and hope to not get caught, which I'd rather not do, I'll probably put more energy into getting on with different majors.

I intend to fly helicopters part time. I have friends with small helicopter businesses, and enjoy the occasional opportunity to fly for them.

Hubble15

AA is more permissive than some others. I know guys who fly for us who also fly fighters for adversary air contractors with the flight office’s blessing. There are other airlines who have not allowed that. Ask around.

That said: you might benefit from a perspective adjustment. If you are even considering “lying and hoping not to get caught”, then you may be suffering from cranial rectitus. I fly a lot of GA, and I instruct (for free) in jet warbirds. None of it is worth putting your meal ticket at risk. You want to fly helos on the side, donate your time.

Sliceback

What's that famous saying "work backwards from the hearing?"
(AA truism by long time, and sometimes author, of our Part I company ops manual).

Do you think AA is going to take the hit when they can distant themselves from corporate liability? Doing outside flying that creates FAR 117 conflicts and then have a significant event? The LIT crash discusses that. Afterwards CP's weren't allowed to do office work and go fly.

MarineGrunt

Whatever you do, play it straight. It would be pretty stupid to blow an easy $350k/yr job over a part time job flying egg beaters... make the best case you can, but if AA says no, I’d leave it at that.

flyinawa

The most fun I've had in years was doing airworthiness demonstrations on a couple of Airbuses owned by a leasing company for a potential client. That was almost 4 years ago and as great as it was I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole anymore for exactly the reason MarineGrunt stated. Fun but no comparison to $350K/year airline pilot fun.

67Creek

That's good to know. Does the FOM allow a means to deviate from the policy, i.e.: "with approval" type language? Or are guys just making gentlemen's agreements with the CPs or others?




The point of me posting this is to try to figure out if I can do it above board with AA. If not, I'm willing to put a bigger portion of time/money into pursing a major that will. No perspective adjustment needed.



If I'm making airline pilot money, the money I make flying helicopters a few hours a month is a drop in the bucket and I don't need it. However, I don't believe in working for free. Taking a job away from another pilot because you're willing to do it for free, because you're making good money elsewhere, is no way to treat your fellow pilots.


That being said, I'd happily donate my time to a good cause/non-profit/etc. But I won't be doing a typically paid job for free.




I have no intention of doing any flying that will interfere with my airline duty time or crew rest.

PRS Guitars

I agree, unless it’s friends or family, or for charity, one shouldn’t be flying for free. Even warbird instruction. I’m sure it’s fun, but it’s also dangerous and requires a lot of prior knowledge. Also it exposes you to lawsuits from family if your student ever buys the farm. All reasons you should not do that for free. Now if you’re talking about a buddy that bought a plane, or just occasional opportunities to fly a warbird, different story. If someone owners a warbird...they can certainly afford to pay for instruction.

Also, is getting compensated the company’s definition of outside professional flying? Or would acting as a CFI even for free be considered professional flying. I don’t know, just wondering.