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-   -   Thoughts on Bailouts? (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/american/128181-thoughts-bailouts.html)

Dobbs18 03-19-2020 08:18 AM


Originally Posted by full of luv (Post 3003619)
Dobbs,
Im not mgmt and it's almost impossible to structure a company to survive no to little revenue fro 1-6months. Your proposal to just stockpile Billions and Billions of profits in cash accounts is not something that capitalist companies do. They have a BOD who manage the company to make as much profit as possible. If they have extra they can reinvest in stuff, grow, pay people more, increase a dividend or buy back shares in the company. The mgmt and BOD have to decide the best use of the money and each has positives and negatives. Because certain companies refuse to repatriate their profits from other countries (like Apple etc) and have huge cash balances outside the US, that is a function of the US tax code and not good corporate governance.

I agree with you in regards to not surviving without revenue, duh!

Slick111 03-19-2020 09:51 AM

I've been reading that the city of Las Vegas, (and state of Nevada) is, for all practical purposes, shut down.

So just out of curiosity, I checked on flights to Vegas tomorrow. We have 11 mostly empty flights tomorrow going from Dallas to Vegas. We have 8 mostly empty flights going to Vegas from LAX. Four from Chicago to Vegas. And Miami is showing 3 mostly empty flights to Vegas. I didn't bother the check other "hub to Vegas" flights.

Who's not making the easy decision to pair down these flights?

Name User 03-19-2020 11:14 AM


Originally Posted by Slick111 (Post 3003986)
I've been reading that the city of Las Vegas, (and state of Nevada) is, for all practical purposes, shut down.

So just out of curiosity, I checked on flights to Vegas tomorrow. We have 11 mostly empty flights tomorrow going from Dallas to Vegas. We have 8 mostly empty flights going to Vegas from LAX. Four from Chicago to Vegas. And Miami is showing 3 mostly empty flights to Vegas. I didn't bother the check other "hub to Vegas" flights.

Who's not making the easy decision to pair down these flights?

I'm not sure but I'm guessing they are probably going to be canceled for April.

dynap09 03-19-2020 11:18 AM


Originally Posted by Slick111 (Post 3003986)
So just out of curiosity, I checked on flights to Vegas tomorrow. We have 11 mostly empty flights tomorrow going from Dallas to Vegas. We have 8 mostly empty flights going to Vegas from LAX. Four from Chicago to Vegas. And Miami is showing 3 mostly empty flights to Vegas. I didn't bother the check other "hub to Vegas" flights.

Who's not making the easy decision to pair down these flights?

Going to 50% of this flying (ie, 5 vs 11 flights) would still be PLENTY of lift. Do a morning flight, midday flight, evening flight and a late night flight or whatever lines up best + 1 more even. The gas, landing fees, pilot and crew costs... the net income per flight has got to be terrible (before even paying for the airplane and company staff that are sitting around as huge fixed overhead)

sanicom3205 03-19-2020 03:48 PM

The amount of gas I burned today alone, with almost no passengers, would pay my salary for a year. Gonna make furlough that much harder to stomach

Buzzlightyear 03-19-2020 04:59 PM


Originally Posted by Cicada (Post 3001087)
Last time, when the banks were collapsing into themselves, they were getting told to merge with others, or go out of business.
Dont be surprised to see some forced marriages of the weakest carriers into others. You could easily see JBlue, Alaska and others get forced marriages with larger carriers as a requirement of a bailout. It could get that bad.

No. The arranged mergers were because of counter party risk. Each party was matched with their partner based on their CDO contracts. This came about after each party refused to take losses on these contracts. Airlines have no counter party risk and majors aren’t dependent on the others as a function of business.

Ashes 03-19-2020 07:32 PM

...because of course the raccoons and the high-functioning sociopaths are out in force on this, looking to get their private losses socialized and their private gains locked in....

highfarfast 03-19-2020 07:53 PM

I’m kinda done hearing about the buybacks. The more I learn about the cash on hand vs assets vs debt vs stock price, the more I think those complaining about the buybacks just don’t get it, and don’t want to.

But I get that the public is going to run with it.

Andrew_VT 03-20-2020 05:39 AM

Wow that was an incredible article. Everyone should read that.

JulesWinfield 03-20-2020 10:11 AM


Originally Posted by sanicom3205 (Post 3004450)
The amount of gas I burned today alone, with almost no passengers, would pay my salary for a year. Gonna make furlough that much harder to stomach

Yes. I don't get it at all. The entire industry is taking crazy pills. It's almost like they're trying to inflate their losses to get more bailout money or something, and then hammer us on the backend to take more leave and furloughs. It's sickening.


Originally Posted by highfarfast (Post 3004705)
I’m kinda done hearing about the buybacks. The more I learn about the cash on hand vs assets vs debt vs stock price, the more I think those complaining about the buybacks just don’t get it, and don’t want to.

But I get that the public is going to run with it.

You don't see a problem with taking on debt and investing that into artificially inflating stock prices and then asking for government money when something happens to lower the value of that stock?


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