Originally Posted by lolwut (Post 1516531)

What does the flying public benefit more from:

1) The ability to go nonstop from their small hometown to the capital of our nation?

2) The ability to get a $39 airfare to Orlando when Southwest adds 10 more flights?


DCA is a hub. A hub brings a lot of benefits to an airport. And theres nothing wrong with an airline having a hub. If anyone needs super cheap fares for their once a year visit to Florida, BWI isn't far away and has more WN than anyone would ever need.

Originally Posted by kingairip (Post 1516554)

My apologies then. I must have gotten the wrong impression when you said, "that airlines who go through bankruptcy feel they deserve to keep the slots that could be sold to satisfy creditors and maintain pensions for their employees."

********Again, my response was to a poster who felt that somehow SWA felt entitled to the slots that might be given up but that somehow the employees and creditors were not entitled to have valuable assets sold to satisfy their claims.


Unfortunately, management (in all industries) will make poor decisions. And, bankruptcy code is designed to get companies back on their feet. Like it or not, that's the way it works.

(As an aside, do you see a little irony that a guy that works for SWA is now the vocal champion of worker's pensions? I won't suggest that SWA was the deciding factor in killing airline employee's pensions; but, don't you think they played a significant role in ending pensions?)


************As a union member I feel that the pensions promised to the employees were negotiated in good faith and should be honored. The managements involved felt that it was okay to under fund those pensions to fund day to day operations (including growth) and then claim there was no money for the pensions.

********BTW SWA has honored and funded my pension through negotiated matching contributions. I will acknowledge that there might be some argument that a DC program could cause the demise of a DB pension at a competitors company.

I agree with you. I think GM should have failed...and the large banks too. But, I don't think liquidation is appropriate in AA's case. In fact, I think AA will be quite successful moving forward...just like Delta and United before them. I think you think that too....if you didn't, I don't think you would waste time on a Saturday arguing with a bunch of poor saps whose employer is in bankruptcy. If you did, that would be poor form, wouldn't it?

Originally Posted by OscartheGrouch (Post 1516599)

I will agree with you (and hope for the sake of the employees) that the new AA will be very successful. That does not mean that the government doesn't have some reason to ask for the divestitures.

The Oscar

You are correct that I could be doing something else on my Saturday. Exchanging ideas and info with other pilots is better way of wording it than you did. I have many friends at other airlines that I feel bad for when this industry stings them. So far I have been very fortunate and I count my blessings.

Originally Posted by satpak77 (Post 1516557)

AMR/LCC should give whatever slots away to whoever and be done with it. Lets look at the 10, 20 year business strategy. So the reduce presence into DCA, ok, so be it. Their entire quarterly earnings statement is not DCA driven, obviously.

Lets stop looking at trees and look at the forest. Better yet, the mountain range.

Originally Posted by FlyingKat (Post 1517262)

The DCA market is one of the most lucrative in the country. Before the merger with America West, it was something like 25% of Airways traffic and 50% of its revenue, which is why the closure of DCA after 9/11 was so devastating to Airways financially. Parker will fight and scratch to keep every slot he can in DCA. It's a gold mine, which is why Southwest, JetBlue, et al are salivating over the idea of getting some of these slots.

Originally Posted by OscartheGrouch (Post 1516584)

Actually LL, I would suggest that allowing an RJ to operate non stop to an from BGR/DCA (as an ex.) is a waste of capacity. I would also suggest that while some of the locals might benefit, those flights are designed to accommodate members of congress (and their staffs) who then will feel obligated to respond in kind to protect said route. Let the smaller airports route through a large hub to get to DCA and then utilize bigger aircraft.

BWI is, as you point out, close enough to allow smaller cities to access the Washington DC area without taking up a slot with a 50 seat RJ.

It is quite obvious that this is all about keeping and increasing the market share so as to control prices to benefit the airline that will be created and not about service for the traveling public.

I know you meant if for emphasis, but a $39 fare would benefit the public. The airline operating it .....not so much.

The Oscar

Originally Posted by satpak77 (Post 1517266)

Good. So if Parker tosses the "gold mine bone" to DOJ, merger should move forward.

Originally Posted by FlyingKat (Post 1517262)

it was something like 25% of Airways traffic and 50% of its revenue, which is why the closure of DCA after 9/11 was so devastating to Airways financially.