Agreed. The 5 seat Scope grab talk wasn't wishful thinking from the company, it was a barely clever politician's ploy. Create a problem, solve said problem... all the while look magnanimous to anyone but the affected party.

We aren't even close to Delta rates if you consider our work rules and profit sharing. I've heard (from some pretty smart numbers guys) that Delta 2015 rates +12-15% would have been a very conservative starting point for ILC compensation. That doesn't even take into account Delta's C2015 that will probably blow that out of the water. Obviously, the company's proposed rates are no where close to that.

- Our work reserve rules are a joke. We had a Spirit CA on the Jumpseat last week who told us they had a minimum of 4 days off on reserve?!? ***, Really?!? Not knocking Spirit at all - good for them, but the World's "most super spectacular airline" isn't even close to that. A buddy at SWA told me they only work 15 days a month on reserve? ***... I've see the MIA reserve lines - Holy Crap they suck!!!

- 5 hours guarantee a day isn't horrible, until you realize that its per "working day" - so that 30 hour layover pays nada - No thanks, how about 5:15 for everyday on duty.

The list goes on, and on... No LOS for furloughs, etc.

American was my number one choice for many reasons, and I want the company to go KDA, make billions and all the other rah-rah stuff but man, this proposal is seriously lacking for a management group that swore up and down a few hours ago about changing culture. I for one don't want to give up anything to make close to what we'll make in Jan of 16.

You expected parker to come out with delta + 40%??? I won't even mention the cost neutral arbitration or what your smoking. I don't think anyone expected parker to give us what you want us to expect from him.

Agreed with Saabs, unlike the FA contract that is market based in terms of pay and work rules specifics after it was voted down (albeit they lost in the pay scale realm for industry leading)...... The pilots contract goes to the arbitrator with a COST Neutral stipulation attached to it (if this gets voted down), AKA no side gets any monetary gains out of it........ So tough decision for the board then the pilots if it gets passed on.... Will see what the board passes out later this week. Initial look seemed rather vague in terms of anything specific minus pay chart.

I read Scott Kirby's bull**** letter on scope. 5 seats is good for everybody. They were the ones that chose to outsource mainline size aircraft. If they want the 5 seats transfer them to mainline like the E-190. It seems he wants a contract done before Delta's new contract. We'll see. It seems the airlines will make record profits for the next few years (this statement is opinion only). If this is true, the Delta guys will continue to see 15% plus in profit sharing. 2014 is supposed to be at least 15%. 5% was paid out early so this is the company's estimate. That is a significant chunk of money. It is not guaranteed, but it is starting to become consistent income.

This feels pathetic to me. I had been thinking better seniority movement at AAL would help offset the inferior payscale for us new hires.

But now it looks like I'd be better off at Delta, or even United, despite the longer upgrade. If either calls, it'd be hard to say no.

Just slide a copy of Delta's current contract back across the table and say the current offer is unacceptable. No improvement to min day and leaving it at min working day is comically ridiculous. 5:30 min day, Delta plus 20, at a bare minimum, and a gentleman's reserve system for starters.

What timeline to upgrade are you forecasting at each?

You are a dream employee.:)

TEN

I don't give a rats ass what you do. :cool:

Good point...I hope everyone isn't getting wrapped up in hourly rates. Like others in here said, it's more about the credit value. A friend of mine at Delta just emailed me and mentioned his pay this month would credit about 130 hours, for 2014 he'll credit right around 1400 hours. What is AA's cap? 1080?