Sliceback

All data is median avg.


First half of 2014 -

Avg. 42. Flows 49, OTS 36


First half of 2015 -

Avg. 45. No break down between flows vs. OTS. I suspect the increase in avg age from 2014 was due to a lower percentage of OTS to flows as recallees reduced the OTS count.

Avg age of the most junior 50 recallees - 48.


106 added to seniority list first half of 2015.
Totals by five year block -

60+ 1
56-59 1
51-55 16
46-50 28
41-45 37
36-40 9
31-35 6
28-30 4

jcountry

9-11 + Age 65 = Whole lot of guys spent much longer than they would have wanted at the regionals.

drinksonme

Where AA has an issue, more than Delta and United, is it will be losing pilots from all ranks, not just off the top in the future. Good for young junior pilots. I doubt Upper management cares as it will not be their problem as they will be long gone when it hits. Not hiring OTS and mainly having older flows fill the bottom is going to have a big impact one day.

jcountry

I think there is more to it than that.

I think mgmt took a look around and saw that a bunch of new hires could be upgrading within a relatively short time (hopefully) if all those retirements kick in.

Maybe they want experience. Maybe that will turn out to be a smart move. These guys have well over a decade in the left seat on average (I would think.) There is no substitute for that kind of thing.

Experience is always good.

Thedude

Yup
and now we have guys that have had their app in for four whole months and complaining that they haven't gotten the call to interview.

Surprise

I disagree. If a 777 CA retires, that will create a lot of training events as the cascade of vacancies works its way all the way to the bottom. If a 320 FO retires, he can simply be replaced by a new hire.

Additionally, hiring "older" guys now will keep the retirement rate relatively steady, instead of having a giant wave to deal with as is happening at AA soon. And I doubt the company wants anyone at the top of the pay scale any longer than necessary.

Sliceback

NAA is going to retire over 7,000 pilots in an 8 year span (2019-2026). Almost 9,000 (2017-2028). That's out of a force of about 13,000.

I don't think management is worried about hiring older guys to balance out a future retirement bubble. If they can manage this wave the next wave will be smaller.

drinksonme

Hahaha you think management put any thought into this. They fill seats with meat, doesn't matter the "experience" as long as it meets the minimum level. If AA did not have huge flow through agreements and a massive amount of furloughs coming back, management would be "'looking'" around" and.....hiring all those pesky regional inexperienced CA's to fill classes.

And that "experience" you speak of...how do you quantify that? You assume older means more? I know pilots who've flown for 30 years and have never seen an engine failure, loss of pressurization, flight control issue and so on. They've never instructed, been check airmen, nothing. Yet I've met junior regional FO's who've seen multiple failure, and regional CA's who've been check airman for years. Experience IS RELATIVE TO YOUR OWN EXPERIENCES!!!!!! You assume a flow through is better cause their older and will be a better CA...really? Or a furlough will be more experienced...how? When I see a flow, I see a lot of bitterness towards AA if they came from Eagle. I see a pilot who did not move onto another place and just accept an uncontrolled fate from AA.

drinksonme

What?? You do realize that BOTH will be leaving AA in the future. Thus the training is now two-fold. They need to hire to replace BOTH a new FO for for the FO going to CA (as you said) to fill the vacancy left by the retiring CA and also, a new FO for a FO retiring. There's no balance at all. It will odd to what a seniority list from both sides as a pilot in the middle.

encore

They're doing this on purpose. Pilots with a lot of longevity cost the company a lot of money. They're topped out on payscales, get a lot of vacation, etc.

Given that, why would you hire some 25 yearold to mainline when you can hire a 50 yearold? That 25 yearold will spend decades at the top of the scale while the 50 yearold won't.

Bonus, by doing it as a flow, you also get to get rid of a top of scale regional captain and replace him with a new-hire that is also at the bottom of the scale.

These flows and management's acceptance of them are very well thought out. It brings down the average longevity at both mainline and the wholly owned regionals. Guaranteed they have calculated exactly what its saving them and it is millions and millions.