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-   -   Do busts really matter if from PNCL or MESA?? (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/career-questions/51223-do-busts-really-matter-if-pncl-mesa.html)

CLECA 06-08-2010 01:59 PM

As a former sim check airman, you can't "GIVE" a compound failure on a type, but an applicant can certainly "CREATE" one on their own. I'm just sayin..........maybe that's the case here.

FlyerJosh 06-08-2010 02:01 PM


Originally Posted by Pinchanickled (Post 823359)
Understandably, there are standards set forth that pilots AND the examiners need to follow. Given multiple failures at the same time is rediculous. If the examiner doesn't create a realistic environment, what do you do?? When you're going missed on a CAT 2, and an engine fire happens along with thrust reverser deployment all at the same time...is overwhelming.


How is a T/R deploy with associated fire a "multiple failure"? Catastrophic failure within the engine could deploy T/Rs and cause a fire indication. Obviously if a T/R is deploying uncommanded you have some sort of catastrophic failure. Going missed from the bottom of a CAT 2 (or 1 or 3) approach is inconsequential.


Originally Posted by BoilerUp
Its been a while...but I didn't think they could give you compound failures on a "jeopardy" checking event?

Correct. However nothing described so far indicates a compounding failure. Compounding failures are permitted provided that they are caused by the pilots improper direct actions (or inaction- failure to take proper corrective procedures could result in related cascade failures.)

If the OP failed a checkride because of a LH Engine T/R deployment at the MAP, which was shortly followed by a RH Engine fire indication, I'd probably give some slack. Personally, if I feel that a sim is being run unfairly, then I'm going to request that the instructor freeze the sim and explain why they feel that their scenario is justified.

That said, when I climb into the sim, I'm usually asking for punishment with a smile on my face. :D Personally, I like having regular training events- even when I was with the airlines I enjoyed climbing into the box every 6 months... Jeopardy event or not.

Orals on the other hand... you can keep those! :eek:

BoilerUP 06-08-2010 02:06 PM

That's what I thought...

Of course, that didn't stop me from getting a circling, OEI, no flap, manual gear extension & emergency brake stop landing for my last approach/landing on my CE500 type ride...:D

"We wouldn't and couldn't have busted you on it but wanted to see if you could handle it all - and yup, you could."

WIFlyer 06-09-2010 06:22 AM

My most fun experience in the sim was OEI smoke filled cockpit doing an ILS on backup instruments and having the working engine catch fire at about 1000' AGL. We got it down and then went to have a beer :D

BoilerUP 06-09-2010 06:28 AM


Originally Posted by WIFlyer (Post 823739)
My most fun experience in the sim was OEI smoke filled cockpit doing an ILS on backup instruments and having the working engine catch fire at about 1000' AGL. We got it down and then went to have a beer :D

I particularly hate the "OEI, operative engine fire at the marker" in the sim - mostly because the first engine took both fire bottles to put a fire out in it so you've got no options.

Punch the Master Warn, tell the PNF you're continuing to the runway and to have CFR standing by, and drive the beast onto the runway for a hard stop, emergency shutdown and evacuation leading directly to the sim center break room for a cup of coffee...:D

JetBlast77 06-09-2010 09:14 AM

My sim partner from training had a strange situation that he now thinks will certainly keep him in the regional ranks forever. He went in for the oral, busted for various reasons, came back the next day, passed the oral, hopped in the sim, had an awful day, then failed the sim. Even though this was all for the same event, apparently training records show this as 2 seperate failed events since they were on different days with different instructors. Although this happened several years ago and he hasn't had any problems since, makes you really want to go in prepared as it seems with the new legislation, a situation like this would probably make any major throw out your application without thinking twice. As for one remote failure though, explain it and learn from it, and I'm sure you'll be fine.


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