Flight control check- ATI
 

The following is not intended to be malicious but a serious issue. As of late I flew with a capt that could not complete a flight control check due to his size. When I noticed a lack of elevator travel on the status page he had to push back off the pedals. I made a comment but wasn’t effective. Im unable to find any written guidance. Is it a union or standards issue? Medical? Im not a fan of this place but don’t want to flame a fellow flyer.

Safety report! If the fat bastard can’t get his belly out of the way then you have a real safety issue. I’m sure V1 will try to hide this issue the same way he did with V2 almost flaming out a jet in SMF.

It's absolutely meant to be malicious! If you're man enough to make an accusation do it to the proper channels. If you're to ignorant to know the proper channels then we have another issue.

yep. pretty much.

You are totally unprofessional. Please leave.

That is a serious safety issue.

If the guy is to big to allow full and free movement of the flight controls then he needs to be removed from flight duty until the situation is corrected.

Send a report to the union and give them a chance to handle the situation.

Depends what you’re flying.
The flight control check is there to make sure the flight controls are clear from any ( internal) obstructions.
I haven’t flown a Part 23 or 25 airplane yet that requires full elevator travel during normal or abnormal operations.
Ask him to slide his seat back for the flight control check.
To me this would be more of a medical issue.

Could this be a safety issue? Maybe, but not during a flight control check on the ground. If a persons size interferes with aircreaft control then yes and I would hope that it would have been identified during simulator training.
That being said if this was a TRUE safety issue for you then why did you continue the flight with this individual? Kind of like saying braking action is NIL then continuing to taxi. I feel that you are only interested in stirring the pot and embarrassing the Captain. I would be careful of such actions as this could be construed as workplace harassment.

File a safety report......takes care of the workplace harassment argument.

Hey, wait a minute...I don’t fly for ATI?? Lol

How is it workplace harassment to inform the union of a probable/ even possible safety issue.

What level of flight control restriction is okay? Who gets to make the decision? I can't find anything in FAA Documentation that says it is okay to have flight control restricted movement. Could you point that out for me?

It is not harassment of any kind to point out to the union or the company for that matter a possible safety of flight issue. It is in fact HIS JOB to alert the proper authorities of any possible safety issues.

Only in bizarro PC world could this possible be seen harassment.

But this person didn’t, they came to a forum where, like us, has anonymity to make public a situation that may be very sensitive to the Captain. A person I’m sure is identifiable now by many just by this description. The place to take this to is the Union/Company preferably in that order.

How aggressively did the FO attempt to make the control check on the ground? Just touch his stomach lightly and stop? Says he made a comment, if truly concerned about the control check ask to have the Capt suck it in or move the seat back. We’ve all flown with individuals that we have had to ask this of, and most of them know this and move before hand. None of us are solid rock and would give if aggressive movement was needed. Bottom line don’t fly if you feel unsafe.

It’s funny though how people start out by saying its not meant to be malicious but then continue to shame someone on a public forum.
The first line should say find a better way.

Straight off the FCOM. Suggest you re-read...

Flight controls .................................................. ........Checked C, F/O

Make slow and deliberate inputs, one direction at a time.

Move the control wheel and the control column to full travel in both directions and verify: • freedom of movement • that the controls return to center • correct flight control movement on the EICAS display

This is what happens when you hire snow flakes

How would it work out if this individual had to evac from the window on the 767?

That would be his problem, no one else’s.

It would probably be like Winnie the Pooh stuck in Rabbits doorway after eating too much honey! :D

..Safety issue or not, I would not fly any aircraft where full and unrestricted flight control movements were not available..I can think of several abnormals / emergencies where full elevator up travel might be needed..Having flown the boeing I know it is a quality machine, but....

Fly safe,
B757

It’s been done.

You’re twisting my argument.
I know what it says so you can ask him to slide his seat back.
I know of no Part 23 or 25 aircraft that requires full elevator control IN FLIGHT during normal or abnormal procedures.
Speed x deflection = desired effect
Now.....as I said...I’d be concerned about medical reasons.
If this guy is so seriously obese it’s not healthy.
And we both know AME’s rubber stamping Medicals.
If this guy keels over in flight and he’s such a fat bastard then you’ll have a problem with the flight controls.
Especially with these guys that click off their shoulder belts right after rotation.

https://hobbydb-production.s3.amazon...25.33_20PM.png

Why would you say this on an open forum? To be malicious, to publicly shame the individual is exactly why some one would make this post rather than going to pro standards and keeping the matter private.
Are you on probation still?

Tackling the important issues at ATI

https://hobbydb-production.s3.amazon...25.33_20PM.png

I think we found Elvis! :p

Well now he didn’t mention names now did he.
And if he is a fat bastard he needs to be called out on it.
He posted here to ask for opinions which he got in droves.

Huh?

Well, I've never needed to use any of the fire extinguishers either! Guess we don't need those either.

You know that’s a BS counter argument.
How much deflection do you use to rotate? To recover from unusual attitudes? High altitude upset? Recover from anything the airplane is certified for?
Read my previous posts, I’m not denying it’s a problem.
Just a medical one in my opinion.
There is some FAA guidance on BMI from like 2013.
AME’s instructed to pay special attention to obese pilots in reference to sleep apnea and such.

I think the engineers at Boeing know how much control authority to design into the aircraft. After all, the rudder has a limiter. But not the elevator.

“Belly Limiter”

What if the problem was a female with a ginormous rack?
Flight safety? Standards?

I think I saw the dude last night. This picture doesn’t even come close. He might even be bigger then JB.

I’m sorry, I didn’t realize you had more than one pilot that fits the description. And why does he “need” to be called out on it, on a public forum?

Lighten up snowflake......this is a tough occupation!

I'd have to evaluate the situation in person. :eek:

I don't know whats worse, being called a snow flake or a liberal? Them fighting words padre

I don't understand your resistance to this issue. There are people who for a variety of physical reasons are to large to fit into the pilot quarters. If you are, and you jam yourself in, it is unsafe.

Regarding the distain for the posting on a public forum, it doesn't matter how we found out about it so please get off that bandwagon. No names were used.

This is an important issue. If the aircraft were to stall and enter a dive, would the ill fitting pilot then be leaning on the controls? How do you plan to recover the aircraft? Just one of many examples I can think of.

Male or Female, if you cannot fit in the available space, then you cannot fly that particular model aircraft. If you were on my aircraft, I would be having you sit out of the way of the controls if at all possible. If that was not possible, I would delay the flight until a suitable replacement showed up.

We get paid the money to not just fly the aircraft but to fly it safely in all circumstances. Compromising safety as to not hurt someone's feelings is very wrong headed.

I'm also not following this.

I'm hearing a lot of you don't really need full travel comments.

If you feel that way then get Boeing or whoever comes up with the flight standards and checklist to change it to 80% travel or whatever "speed x deflection" formula you have.

Or get the company to sign off on not using the checklist item.

People like you are why I left the Republican Party.

EDIT: And I live in a swing state.

really? "people like him"
and you say that because you know him
I think not

"YOU PEOPLE"......just need to get over yourselves.