Fdx Mec Rep Recall
 

I’ve been reading the posts about pilots dissatisfaction with the way the MEC and DW is/has handled the Age 60 Issue as well as other issues at FDX. However, I don’t see or hear much about what’s being done to change the MEC representatives. I understand that the issue of recall of representatives has been requested for LEC 26’s next meeting. Any other LEC initiating the same action?? In my opinion, I’ve seen enough “spin” and “damage control” from this MEC and it’s officers. It’s time for them to go.

Micro,

The Age 60 ruling is going to change! Period! Whether we like it or not. A pilot on the seniority list deserves to be able to bid and hold whatever his or her seniority allows. Questions? None! Let's put that issue away.

We have a bigger issue coming up. A potential LOA covering two new foreign domiciles. This is going to have a big impact on FedEx's crew force. Many of you have no interest in bidding either domicile. I understand that. But, everyone needs to understand the issues and not allow a substandard LOA to be shoved down our throat.

If our leadership rolls over on this one, then I am one that will be advocating regime change.

Prezbear, The age 60 ruling is NOT the issue. The issue is substandard representation and leadership by our MEC and Officers on a number of issues that age 60 was only a part of. I don't trust them anymore on any issue. How many times do you have to be "slapped" before you say ENOUGH (if they rollover on your next issue (potential LOA on foreign domiciles)???). My question was (and is): If the FDX pilots are angry and no longer trust this MEC and the officers, what's being done to change them.

Your right! I agree, Age 60 is not the issue. The issue here is representation. And I am sick of hearing, "You're only 80 guys! In reference to the Subic domicile.

Prez,

Before you get into a big discussion with him looks like he just signed up and has 2 posts. Smells a bit fishy....


Past...

Yes, you're only 80 guys, but with very BIG smiles on your faces.:D :D

Jet,

Do you have any idea how expensive two smiley faces are in Hong Kong?? Ok, well I don't either, but they can't be cheap. Di ba?

Yogi Bear- I think everyone wanting th age 60 rule to change is trying to put out the perception that its a done deal. Hoping people will just accept it and be quiet.

This rule is not a Slam dunk! Have you ever heard of the NPRM? Even Blakley said we will listen to everyone during the NPRM. And if the Silent Majority gets Vocal, this rule will die. Especially when the AMR, APA, NWA and the 70% of all other 121 pilots say go pack sand ICAO.

I can see why all you old farts are trying to spin it this way, hoping everyone has Apathy.

130JDrvr, I didn't "know" that subjects couldn't be discussed just because someone just joined the forum:confused:. But to rid the fishy smell...the site would not accept ANY new registrations for about a weeks time around the beginning of the month. And what, nobody wanted to answer you when you only had two posts:D. So how about your view on the subject??

The Alpa constitution makes it very hard to get rid of representatives and even harder to get rid of an officer (DW, WH, CB). But the start is getting the request for recall ballots on your LEC's agenda through your LEC Chairman in writing. Then we get to decide if their out or not. Hopefully all the "anger" I see on this forum gets directed to remove these representatives and officers.

Nasher is right... check www.govtrack.us S.65 and HR.1125 are far from a "done deal"


Legislation > 110th U.S. Congress (2007-2008)
S. 65: A bill to modify the age-60 standard for certain pilots and for other purposes

Bill Status




Jan 4, 2007http://www.govtrack.us/media/checkmark.gifIntroduced- not Scheduled for Debate- not Voted on in Senate- not Voted on in House- not Signed by President

This bill is in the first step in the legislative process. Introduced bills go first to committees that deliberate, investigate, and revised bills before they go to general debate. The majority of bills never make it out of committee.

Bill Overview

Sponsor:Sen. James Inhofe [R-OK]show cosponsors (25)
Cosponsors
Sen. Wayne Allard [R-CO]
Sen. Robert Bennett [R-UT]
Sen. Christopher Bond [R-MO]
Sen. Samuel Brownback [R-KS]
Sen. Jim Bunning [R-KY]
Sen. Thad Cochran [R-MS]
Sen. John Cornyn [R-TX]
Sen. Larry Craig [R-ID]
Sen. Michael Crapo [R-ID]
Sen. John Ensign [R-NV]
Sen. Michael Enzi [R-WY]
Sen. Russell Feingold [D-WI]
Sen. Charles Grassley [R-IA]
Sen. Orrin Hatch [R-UT]
Sen. Kay Hutchison [R-TX]
Sen. John Isakson [R-GA]
Sen. Jon Kyl [R-AZ]
Sen. Joseph Lieberman [I-CT]
Sen. John McCain [R-AZ]
Sen. Lisa Murkowski [R-AK]
Sen. Bill Nelson [D-FL]
Sen. Ken Salazar [D-CO]
Sen. Ted Stevens [R-AK]
Sen. Craig Thomas [R-WY]
Sen. David Vitter [R-LA]
Cosponsorship information sometimes is out of date.

Last Action:Jan 4, 2007: Read twice and referred to the Committee on Commerce, Science, and Transportation.Full Text:View Full Text of Bill

I agree with you 100%!!! I've discussed this with almost all our reps and our MEC chairman but all they see is their spin on the subject.

However, this "we know better than you" MEC has pulled this move on other issues.
1. Scope payments- The MEC dropped them into an account (vice returning them to the pilots) because they had a "better" use for them. They used the money to pay for something the company should be paying for anyway... I was last told it was a negotiating tactic????? Why not ask the pilots what they want to do with it or suggest a use and get their approval.
2. Contract- Besides being a piece of c**p, the union couldn't video the roadshow and send it out to the masses who DON'T live in MEM??? Then DW sends out his "red letter" on why we shouldn't vote this contract down. I guess line pilots aren't smart enough to make up our own minds. maybe we're just lemmings :D.

It's time for the all knowing/seeing MEC and officers to go. I'm tired of hearing them hide behind comments like "fiduciary responsibility" and the pilots best "interests".

Age 60 is a done deal just as the Immigration Bill is a done deal. The Immigration Bill had far more support than Age 60, and they're back to the drawing board to try to drum up more support. I also heard that the AOPA is fighting the FAA authorization bill since it has user fees included. Funny how they won't get told by a congressman that "unless you change you position, we won't talk to you..."

I think that Prater spun that whole thing about congress not talking to us unless we changed our position. I worked in DC for a while and NEVER heard a congressman say that he/she won't talk unless you change. That's not the way it works up there. I'd like to see one memo that a senator/congressman wrote even suggesting that they wouldn't talk unless ALPA changed positions. Of course they'll say, well they don't write memos it was all verbal. The fast track only started when Prater took office, I'll bet that he told those Sen/Reps "you don't worry about ALPA, I'll get a change."

Prater said we need to Take it Back, I agree we just need to take back our own union first.

Next Tuesday there is an LEC meeting in town where an interim block 5 rep will be elected. You have a great chance to make an impact if you show up at that meeting.

Come on guys, FH and the APAAD boys, not to mention our MEC, said this would all be wrapped up by Memorial Day. Of this year.

Its in the bag, just a matter of time.

Thanks ALPA National EB and FedEx MEC, for selling us out for this "done deal".

FJ

Another hub turn meeting tonight at 12:30. What new spin and damage control will we hear tonight. I'll attend just to hear the "BS". I could hope that DW would be there to announce his resignation but I doubt he'd give up the great deal he has. Maybe if no one attended they'd get the message that they have destroyed whatever unity this pilot group had.

I pay my 2% so I don't have to attend those. Good magazine though, lots of pictures.

I tried making this point as well. People with experience in the legislative process know this explanation from ALPA was at best INCOMPLETE!!

Micro,

It happens on here from time to time. People get a new screen name, drop a bomb and run. turns into the same old comments and arguments for days.

Welcome and give us a brief of the meeting tonight.

Past....

130JDrvr,
Thanks for the welcome!! I'll let you all know what great wisdom DW spews tonight. Hopefully, someone else can give their view of the meeting as I have a very shaded view of the union at the moment.

With 18 hours notice kind of hard to change plans to be there.

If someone with big balls has the gumption to say out loud what a lot of folks are feeling, it could save a lot of work for some folks...

I continue to firmly believe that our Union leadership sold us a bill of goods on the Age 65 Legislation being a "slam dunk" and that the train was "leaving the station" and we needed to get on it or we couldn't help steer. As I have repeatedly said; this legislation is small potatoes to Congress. If it doesn't have significant social or financial implications to our nation or doesn't help get them re-elected, they won't waste one ounce of political capital on legislation that is pushed by and appeases a very small group of aging whining airline pilots.
Our union reps need to be held accountable for this debacle. The junior block reps should resign immediately simply because they abandoned their constituents in order to align themselves with DW and the senior cadre he continuously represents and patronizes. Odd....that train whistle leaving the station just may have been the rallying cry for the membership to wake up and ask our reps to explain their unwillingness to represent their constituency as the formal polling indicated the "overwhelming majority" wanted to be represented.

Bury the sponsor Senators with a deluge of how you feel about the age 65 thing. I agree, it's not a done deal. If you dont like it speak out where it can help.

Maybe you should start with the Speaker of the House:

Good luck! Sadly, I think you may be spinning your wheels.

Just returned from the union hub turn meeting with DW. Almost the entire discussion revolved around the FDA's in Paris and China. A LOA is in the works that will be presented to the membership in the near future. Overview is a two year commitment that will pay an additional $84K above salary (Stipen?Bonus??) and a tax equalization paid by the company so that the pilots will not be penalized by higher taxes in those two countries. The company is hiring Price/Waterhouse to help pilots wade through the tax implications. The pilot domicile in china will be in Hong Kong with the trips starting from there with ground transportation to the airport. I guess we'll have to see and read the LOA to decide if it's worth it.
DW made a plea to not take out the anger towards the MEC and Officers by killing this LOA. His better idea was to recall the MEC reps and then have the new MEC recall him. An excellent idea!!!!
Anyway, it seems that the MEC and DW have taken the stance that the anger towards the union over non-representation will blow over (Pilot apathy??) and they will be able to continue with business as usual. I truly hope that will not be the case.

more details from the hub turn meeting...
12 757s - Paris
5 Airbus - China
Must live w/in 100 miles of respective airports (don't have to live in Hong Kong)
Pricewaterhouse does your taxes on FX dime
Union wants to give 14days to view LOA, then 14 days to vote
-should be no seat bid until after LOA

Next seat bid:
-company wants 3yr training cycle
-DW estimate: LOA in mid-late July, bid in mid-late Aug
-no 777 on this bid


Those are my notes, feel free to correct if you were there. I missed the beginning so thanks for the post Micro.

Thanks guys.

How assinine is that!!! Does she know what kind of pandoras box she's opening with this letter?!?! Is she going to request an exemption for everyone with the same record and standing?? Stupid...politicians suck

She must be out of her mind. Let me apologize, in advance, to the 60+ guys/gals I am about to offend. I currently fly with a 62 year old gent who is the salt of the earth. When I started here he was 57 and did alright, but over the past 5 years I, and everyone, else has noted a marked decline in his skills. It is a fact of life that as the body ages it loses a step or two along the way. I am not saying that it is true for every person but it is true for the majority. When my dad go older he gave up flying voluntarily, because he was aware of this slowing. I just wish that common sense would outweigh the egos of those individuals in question. It is a safety issue period. Sorry.:(

Is it $84K per year cause I heard it was $42K and it's taxable, dues, but would add to retirement. So if you don't take any for your 401K, take your dues and let's say 28% tax you'll make you'll only get $2470 per month. Then figure out that your dollar isn't work but 66% of that to the Euro, that really gives you after everything $1630 per month... :mad: That sucks far worse that if the company just paid no-taxable COLA.
BUT ALPA will get about $130,000 extra if CDG has 160 pilots. Then add another $130,000 if HGK has 160 pilots. Good way to pay for those Ruth Chris dinners...

You're right. Sorry if I didn't state it more clearly. $42K per year for two years = $84K. However, DW led me to believe that if you stayed longer than two years the $42K per year would continue. You're also right that it would be taxable income so Alpa would get their $$$$. Just think, you get to pay even more for *******Y representation.:D Maybe we could get the dues reduced by reducing DW's compensation package.

If it is taxable, then it is Pensonable, which means a higher factor for your High 5 formula.

Up to the $260K limit. Anyone know why it is not cola, besides the obvious ALPA 2%? We certainly figured out how to make the VEBA $25K + interest tax and dues free.

There aren't too many 727 Pilots (NB) making 260K, with the exception of training Dept or MGT guys on passover.

But how many pilots making the move will hit the $260K ceiling? I don't know, but I would suspect more than half of the dudes working for high five would.

My point is Like it or not the 757 is on the NB payrate. That is what this crew force ratified.

My point was that Domestic 727 Pilots (Capts) won't come close to the irs limit of 260K. Assuming the rumors from last nights Hub meeting, the CDG NB757 pilots will make about the same as a domestic WB pilot will make you factor in INTL override, INTL per diem and whatever extra they decide to pay. Will ones buying power be the same in Europe? No way, but your Pensionable Income (and High 5 formula) will be substantially higher as a Euro NB pilot that a Domestic NB pilot. That was my only point.

As for HKG, this is WB pay. They (Capts) will all hit the 260K limit for High 5.
Again will the HKG based pilot have the same buying power? That depends on many factors.
Most of us Jr to Mid WB capts don't come close to that, unless we fly carry over or a little xtra.

Now it remains to be seen who will actually bid CDG or HKG. Will a JR or Mid seniority Widebody CAPT bid it? I don't know.
Will SFS just transfer up? who knows
Will a domestic 727 CAPT or FO BID it? Maybe

Personally I won't because of several factors. Pay is only part of the equation for me, but it isn't the top priority.

I agree with what you are saying. It's more than just money, but that's not what the meeting was about last night. People choose QOL and not live in Memphis, but that's on the individual, not thanks to the MEC.

That taxed $42K won't go far. Wouldn't it be better for everyone (other than the ALPA payroll) if that pay was COLA. It's not taxable, so you would get that $42K to use. You don't have to pay Uncle Sam his portion, nor does Fred have to pay Pepe Le Pew his portion of taxes on that $42K, which is a great bargaining tool - we the pilots are saving the company money, so why not make it an even $48K as the EU taxes will cost the company far more that $6K. just thoughts to consider.

Wonder if DW will say the company won't talk to us unless we change our position and only agree with what Fred says, but we'll have some input....:rolleyes:

And my point is the fact that it is pensionable will impact a very small minority of the guys making the move. And of those, many will hit the $260K limit. If we wanted to make it a better incentive we would find a way to give everyone who makes the move more spending power. Not just the all important senior guys who can afford to do this to boost their high five (so they don't have to dip into their tax and dues free 25K plus interest veba fund).

Your post has merit, but Realize that the company doesn't have to offer us anything. That is the frustrating Part.

Were you here when the Postal cpntract was announced?
Remember when the company wanted an LOA to fly us More days?

The Union countered with what many thought was excessive demands.
The company said Politely.....GFY and just implented new optimization and we got nothing. The Pilots all looked to the Union and said.....WTF? Why didn't you get us something?

We are kind of in the same boat here. The company wants something. They will offer us something. Pilots think "it isn't enough". Pilots say "ask for the Moon" and that would make many Pilots feel better.............until the company
does the same thing and nowwe have Pilots living in Europe and China making 36,000 less per year than they would have.............I can hear the complaints coming.......Why didn't we get soemthing??

Can you be forced to a foreign domicile?
 

If we were hired in MEM for a job in MEM, can we be involuntarily forced to move to a foreign country? If not then the company will NEED a LOA to make a "offer" to entice guys to move overseas. Without it, I'm not sure if they can force people to move.