Fdx 3&3
02-17-2008, 06:32 PM
#23
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Joined APC: Jun 2007
Posts: 68
FDX, the 3&3 difference...
I posted the same question on the Majors board, and now I know why they are the "Majors". I see several differences here;
Some real jealously of senior pilots in either seat, who value life style more than sleeping in hotel rooms.
Captains who somehow think that landings are of some $$$ value.
Short sighted pilots in both seats that can't understand that if the company builds the lines that are short on landings, than the company should "Pay" to send that person to the sim for landings.
Do you realize that Captains are now training Captains, for no extra pay, when someone PDO bumps a guy to "get current", and just how that's going to look if and when there is a problem.
We are so worried that someone other than our greedy self is getting away with something, when we should be worried about what is safe and that we have people working for no pay to satisfy a FAA requirement, when they should be paid. Next we will be going to the Sim on our days off for no pay.
Last, what is it about FDX pilots that cannot help from answering with childish answers, profanity (the WTFM comment) and venom toward their own brethren, making themselves look like complete idiots?
Go ahead, you can't help yourself, and the company loves it, again no wonder they took the "Purple Tails" site away.
Some real jealously of senior pilots in either seat, who value life style more than sleeping in hotel rooms.
Captains who somehow think that landings are of some $$$ value.
Short sighted pilots in both seats that can't understand that if the company builds the lines that are short on landings, than the company should "Pay" to send that person to the sim for landings.
Do you realize that Captains are now training Captains, for no extra pay, when someone PDO bumps a guy to "get current", and just how that's going to look if and when there is a problem.
We are so worried that someone other than our greedy self is getting away with something, when we should be worried about what is safe and that we have people working for no pay to satisfy a FAA requirement, when they should be paid. Next we will be going to the Sim on our days off for no pay.
Last, what is it about FDX pilots that cannot help from answering with childish answers, profanity (the WTFM comment) and venom toward their own brethren, making themselves look like complete idiots?
Go ahead, you can't help yourself, and the company loves it, again no wonder they took the "Purple Tails" site away.
02-17-2008, 06:52 PM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Posts: 424
Was that,
It isn't jealousy toward senior pilots or that landings are worth $$$. A professional aviator will take care of his currency, end of story. There are times where this doesn't happen due to vacation, reserve, high mins capts, etc. Of course these guys get a break, but a very senior pilot that chooses to bid lines that doesn't have landings is another story. If he doesn't care or take care of his currency, I could care less as well. Go to the sim, pick up a makeup trip, PDO bump, or go noncurrent. There are ways to get your landings, but you might actually have to work for it. Most people are adult enough to take care of themselves, those that don't can go to the sim...
On a similar subject, wasn't there an accident recently that involved a female professional RFO? Maybe a few landings wouldn't have hurt.
As far as I understand, if you go NOQ, you get paid to do your landings. Is this correct?
It isn't jealousy toward senior pilots or that landings are worth $$$. A professional aviator will take care of his currency, end of story. There are times where this doesn't happen due to vacation, reserve, high mins capts, etc. Of course these guys get a break, but a very senior pilot that chooses to bid lines that doesn't have landings is another story. If he doesn't care or take care of his currency, I could care less as well. Go to the sim, pick up a makeup trip, PDO bump, or go noncurrent. There are ways to get your landings, but you might actually have to work for it. Most people are adult enough to take care of themselves, those that don't can go to the sim...
On a similar subject, wasn't there an accident recently that involved a female professional RFO? Maybe a few landings wouldn't have hurt.
As far as I understand, if you go NOQ, you get paid to do your landings. Is this correct?
02-17-2008, 07:29 PM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: A300CAP
Posts: 479
Originally Posted by nightfreight
As far as I understand, if you go NOQ, you get paid to do your landings. Is this correct?
02-17-2008, 07:29 PM
#26
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Joined APC: Jun 2007
Posts: 68
Originally Posted by nightfreight
Was that,
As far as I understand, if you go NOQ, you get paid to do your landings. Is this correct?
As far as I understand, if you go NOQ, you get paid to do your landings. Is this correct?
Yes we did have a problem with an RFO, and again, what recourse does a Captain or F/O have if someone shows up doing a PDO bump "to remain professional" that is due in say 7 days? They can go with you for one day or to the sim for several, be pulled off a trip, not be paid, and suffer the rath of all.
Is this fair to all, are we running an airline or a on the job training center?
Call the union and ask what happens if you go NOQ.
02-17-2008, 07:33 PM
#27
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Joined APC: Jun 2005
Position: FO
Posts: 104
If one of us was going to go NOQ because of landings, most companies have scheduling work with the pilots. Our scheduling does not work with us for the most part. It's our fault... We shouldn't have to PDO bump somebody, pickup open time. It is on the professional side to work with one another (scheduling) to stay current. They bump someone and pay them the other guy gets the landings. Cost of doing business. I haven't gone NOQ or plan on it for landing currency. They can turn the optimizer down, build better lines.
I think you get paid for the landings, any trips caught in between are dropped for makeup.
I think you get paid for the landings, any trips caught in between are dropped for makeup.
02-17-2008, 07:50 PM
#28
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Joined APC: Jun 2007
Posts: 68
I didn't get paid, lost the trip, and even the sim instructor referred to it as "being punished". I called the union and found no help, no offer of help, and no future of help.
I do appreciate nightfreight, subicpilot, hschol and the others that have kept it professional on their opinions and beliefs, and I see all sides.
Go look at the 3 responses on the Majors board to the same question, maybe we are doing something wrong here and if you got paid to get 3&3 and could make up the trip we'd have more current pilots, and what's so bad about asking for a little training?
What kind of mind set says that we don't want you to come to the simulator, go use a $50,000,000 plane, with a new Captain or we won't pay you.
so how do we fix it, because as I understand it from an Asst. C/P it's a bigger problem than just one or two people a month, more like p/week.
I do appreciate nightfreight, subicpilot, hschol and the others that have kept it professional on their opinions and beliefs, and I see all sides.
Go look at the 3 responses on the Majors board to the same question, maybe we are doing something wrong here and if you got paid to get 3&3 and could make up the trip we'd have more current pilots, and what's so bad about asking for a little training?
What kind of mind set says that we don't want you to come to the simulator, go use a $50,000,000 plane, with a new Captain or we won't pay you.
so how do we fix it, because as I understand it from an Asst. C/P it's a bigger problem than just one or two people a month, more like p/week.
02-17-2008, 08:15 PM
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Posts: 424
Was that,
There are ways to get landings most of the time. It usually isn't that difficult. Again, we aren't talking about people that were sick or had made attempts to get their landings. We are talking about pro RFOs that make no attempt, then want someone else's leg. We've all been short before, but most of us found a way to get a landing. I've never had to PDO bump anyone, but have flown some crappy trips to keep current.
There are ways to get landings most of the time. It usually isn't that difficult. Again, we aren't talking about people that were sick or had made attempts to get their landings. We are talking about pro RFOs that make no attempt, then want someone else's leg. We've all been short before, but most of us found a way to get a landing. I've never had to PDO bump anyone, but have flown some crappy trips to keep current.
02-17-2008, 08:55 PM
#30
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2005
Position: FO
Posts: 104
Our voice is our union. Unfortunately in our case, our union doesn't want to hear our voice.
I think most of us would like to fix the problem. We need to fix the problem. Being professionals is a start, I think we are there; but that would take cooperation from the management side of the house (scheduling). And they don't want to hear from us either. Going NOQ is a punishment for us, from scheds, instructors, management. It would make more since if we could get along. This ain't that tough of a subject. They make it that.
I think most of us would like to fix the problem. We need to fix the problem. Being professionals is a start, I think we are there; but that would take cooperation from the management side of the house (scheduling). And they don't want to hear from us either. Going NOQ is a punishment for us, from scheds, instructors, management. It would make more since if we could get along. This ain't that tough of a subject. They make it that.
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