yes. that's what the contract says, but......

i have heard in the last few months that DPs have been put on VTO lines without being "specifically requested".......

not sure if that's true, just the rumor I heard.

And that after the fact, the VTO holder was given the option of 1) flying the trip at 150%, 2) dropping the trip and selecting Substitution - then the trip would be awarded back to them at 100% as a Sub trip, or 3) dropping the trip and refusing the trip in Substitution and being able to pick up another trip in OTP (110%) - but there weren't any trips to pick up, so you basically lose the pay for the trip that month and it sits in your OTP bank unuseable.

So, basically, by violating the contract, and then dangling the 150% carrot in front of the guy, the DP gets flown by a "volunteer" and undermines the process even more than if someone had picked it up out of straight open time (because the company violates the intent/letter of the contract by putting the DPs on a VTO line unrequested)

......of course......this all ass-u-me-s that these guys did NOT "specifically request" these pairings for their VTO requests.......

.......OR......as apparently is the case of Captain M.F., these guys all got Reserve lines on their VTO and the company already put them on these trips.......only M.F. has clarified so far....

we may never know, 'cause if they did ask for them, they probably won't fess up to it on this web board anyway.

 

thanks for taking the time/effort to clarify.

I'd like to think/hope that this is what has happened to the ANC FOs on these DPs as well.

 

I am assuming I got Reserve on my VTO but they are not published yet.It just says "RSV" next to my name when I pull up the trip.As a matter of fact when I did they worksheet for the secondary conversion I only put two trip in and I was extra careful and made sure they wee not DP's.The other request was to make it commutable.

 

This is totally unsat.

Folks need to e-mail the SIG, block rep and David Taylor.

The option should be reserve days instead of the DP. Offering special deals at 150% is a contract violation.

Offering anything other than a non-DP trip or reserve days is an issue that needs to be handled by the union. Being denied BLG or being forced to do it in Sub is NOT the right answer.

 

If there is lying then it will be found out when the union investigates it.

 

Often pairings are assigned a day or two before VTO lines are released. Although the pairing shows the pilots assigned to them, their individual schedules will not show the trip.

 

The real "didn't request a DP on my VTO line" answer is outlined in this grievance settlement link. Not sure if there is any recourse if they are calling it an advanced assigned line check; which IMHO is still a cheap shot to fill a DP.

 

I hadn't seen this grievance settlement - thanks for the link.

This is EXACTLY what happened in Dec 07 (I'm pretty sure that was the month??) in ANC.

The company (M.S.) assigned a huge DP trip to a VTO F/O - "by accident" or "in error", and then the FO had the options available to him (150%, Sub, OTP) - forcing him/her to choose to either support the SIG process and lose the entire month's pay ('cause there's no open time to make it up), or take the 150% carrot and subvert the whole SIG process - completely through no fault of the pilot's.

Doesn't matter if this has already been grieved and settled before though.

Every time the company makes this "error" - it should be grieved again and again.

Does anyone think the company could really convince arbitrator that the assignment was "an accident"?? c'mon fellas.....

 

You guys are on the right track, but let's not drift off into left field. Since you're asking for hands raised--I'll be glad to. Names CA. Dead last on the C list in ANC. That was probably me you guys are getting your hackles wound up about, after I posted my saga here a couple months ago. My bud MS (he of the "bid VTO opposite of what you want" theory) assigned a DP on a VTO when it was NOT specifically requested. And the game was on.

I'm sure there are more. Not all are DP fliers by choice. Oh.. I just flew with a guy who filed a complaint/grievance with the union over VTO scheduling. Seems he asked for an "R" line in ANC, and got a line. But he was senior to 15 of the guys below him...some of who got an "R" line instead.

So the system isn't perfect, and sometimes it's a lot less than that, but sometimes bringing this stuff into the open is a step in the right direction. Hey, with a little luck and a tailwind it just might improve...

 

I spoke with M.S. in crew planning about this exact situation two days ago, as I had questions about my VTO. His answer was that DPs WILL NOT be assigned to a VTO holder unless specifically requested. (I'm guessing he meant "from now on" )

That being said, I'm not going to jump to conclusions on the two FO offenders until I get some emails back.

Frankly, given the -600 employee numbers, I won't be surprised if they requested them. Something obviously got lost on that crowd...but we'll see. Apologies to all my PN homies who continue to fight the good fight. Call these guys out!