If you were 60+ years old and the company reduced BLG to 48hours ,as required by the contract prior to furlough; would you keep your job or would you retire? That may be incentive enough to move some of them out into their rocking chairs and may actually stave off the furlough process. ...but then again, maybe not.

Isn't this only for one bid period?

The contract doesn't seem very clear about it. It says the BLG shall be reduced for one month, but it doesn't say it shall stay low or it shall go back up.

From the CBA:

"At least a full bid period must follow the announcement of this action. "

I'm sure I'll hear from the Karate Kid for giving my interpretation...But, I would read that to mean the company must give one month's notice before lowering the min BLG.

Not only will they be paying move packages out there, but I believe they will be paying them to come back when a bid comes out and they can hold MEM again...This whole thing is pretty stupid IMO

So, assuming they did reduce it to 48 hours (for one month or several), do the Reserve Line Holders still have to stand 15 days? That would suuuuuck. I can't find anything other than the Reserve Lines Shall be built to a maximum of 15/19 days.

What I can find in the contract is that yes they can make you stand 15/19 days but once you reach RLG (48/60) the rest of your r-days get dropped

Great, We'll have thirty guys on first fly every day.

Get your Captain Houses up FOR SALE ..............................

Nope, I will wait and let FedEx buy my FO house.

It's about the health care---that's what the ND tell me.
 

The ND's I've talked with are saying it's all about the 100's of dollars/month they will save in health care costs. That savings won't mean a lot when they mort at 65 becuase of GREED not cheap health care. How about they "DO THE RIGHT THING" ---to coin a phrase from DW---and just retire. Sorry about being master of the obvious.

48 hours at WB Capt pay exceeds 72 hours of S/O pay, which is where they came from. Face it, the ND crowd will retire on their 65th birthday and not a day before and not for any logical reason you can come up with.

didn't they also tell you that they were planning on living forever?

all those studies and "morting at 65" (as you say) don't apply to any of them.

just ask them......they'll tell ya........:rolleyes:

Man, you nailed that one.
So here's my next question. Are any of those bumped to F/O from Captain, going to wear your four stripes for your trips with the returning NDs in the left seat? I hope...I hope....I hope.......:D

I'm thinking of taping over my 4th stripe with electrical tape like Chatty. :D

I've been saying since the 1st of the year that this is probably PC scrambling to keep his job!

... yeah.. he was such a class act when he went to the back!

You need to stay in MEM and find a crash pad!

Nah, they'll go back to the panel:mad:
fbh

I still think this move serves two purposes 1) Fill HKG and 2) eliminate as much PO pay as you can (casued by Purple Nuggets and 72 FOs).

I do not know if HKG will get filled, but, I think the subsequent training letter will be cut off just above the Purple Nugget range to kill PO pay.

My question is what if HKG doesn't get filled? How will HKG get filled? Furlough then recall into an FDA? Newhires?

Furlough and recall to FDA.

Must be the same ND Chucklehead walking around the AOC with a pair of epaulets that he took a pair of scissors to and NO JOKE, cut it down from 4 stripes to 3!! :eek:

Can't wait to see Practice Bid #2!!!!

TSDeeez Nutzzz

How many folks do you think will take the furlough recall to the FDA? If it comes to that, how deep will the cut go before they stop the bleeding?

If you keep flicking the switch, someone in HKG will go crazy from the lights going on and off;)

It is going to get interesting, that's all I can say. I feel lucky to have a job even if I am sliding backward due to the prunes....I would rather be a plumber that be unemployed!:cool:

Bid what you want, after the FDA get's filled, I would expect a "clean up bid."(with about ten practice bids)

HJ

Was that a response to my post? No switch flipping here. I am just noting that the company doing a (-1) excess in every seat in the latest bid shows that the company knows how to stay three steps ahead of the union to do what they want. They, in effect, did a bump and flush. They know how to do end-arounds on our contract. So how do they get around the no-excessing-to-a-FDA part of the CBA? Furlough and immediate recall to HKG!!!! Trim 150 from the roster. Force the next 40-50 to HKG. Eliminate passover pay. All without having to sweeten the FDA pot!! Guys will have to chose going broke paying for private school and the rent in HKG, or their job. That is why we need a REAL expat package. You listening FE?

I heard they figured out the transport in HKG, the train. Cab was 4 hours. Train should be about 2, doesn't run all the time though, "The World On Time". Could transport via air but that is too much at $160 a flight.

I think the way to force guys into HKG is to threaten what DaRaiders mentioned. And then are only TOOL, the union, will say our hands are tied. They are going by what the contract says. Gonna be hard to pull of 48 credit hours.

My understanding is that the train is not an option, as public transportation of any kind is in violation of the CBA and LOA. The LOA would have to be modified to allow the train.

You are right Subic. I did have a jumpseater today, Captain. Had it from the ACP for HKG, train is going to pushed on the guys there. Besides it will go senior. Oh yeah and it will be an addition to the current POS LOA. Any addition is good right? For what it is worth he said the train was the idea or whatever dartboard they are throwing at now.

took the train from GZ to HKG .... not too bad except for the immigration lines on both ends and the mass of people jostling to board first.

Did you happen to hear if, by doing the train thing, the pairings would be lengthened by a day to allow DH by train, crew rest, then operate?

Who was in charge of due diligence?
 

If we are going to change the LOA again lets get the invol STV eligibility window changed back from 1 every 6 bid periods (LOA) to 1 in 14 (contract). This will fix one of the most blantant stick it to the junior guy provisions (at least in the LOA).

See item G.2. of the proposed ammendments to the LOA.

There's a link to it in the Special Message Line of 06-04-08 which can be found under the "stay informed" header on the right side of the FDX ALPA homepage.

Thanks for pointing that out! I think I may need a re-read...obviously missed that the first time around.

Not sure this is a bad deal. Gonna have to take a closer look...

Excellent post.

Clearly, how often someone can be involuntarily STV'd is a "cost nuetral" issue for the company ---- 1 every 6 vs 1 every 14 is just a "senior" vs "junior" issue regarding "how protected" the top guys are from invol STV'd.

Please don't use the "don't worry, it will go senior argument" ---- cause if that's true, then you still won't mind changing it.

OK --- senior guys ---- here's a GREAT issue where you can show your willingness to "share the pain"....any takers?

This one's not about $$$...

...and you'd still get the best lines over in HKG if you got non-vol'd due to your seniority.

Perhaps, if I saw this type of change incorporated into the FDA LOA Amendment than I would believe we actually "negogiated" some significant improvements and would see a tangible example of how senior guys are stepping up to help out in trouble times.

Note that this provision goes back and modifies the CBA, not just the LOA, and therefore this provision isn't limited to HKG domiciled pilots. It means that ANYONE with a HKG-CAN leg on their trip can be given GT by commercial carrier. Train and hydrofoil are specifically included, but nothing is excluded, so bus is fair game. It also applies to any other int'l location the SIG approves. NRT-HND? How about SFS-MNL by bus?

Note also that this little provision never made it to the MEC's "See what a great amendment to the LOA we got you" summary. Hmmmm

Excellent post.

Clearly, how often someone can be involuntarily STV'd is a "cost nuetral" issue for the company ---- "1 every 6" vs "1 every 14" is just a "senior" vs "junior" issue regarding "how protected" the top guys are from invol STV'd.

OK --- senior guys ---- here's a GREAT issue where you can show your willingness to "share the pain"....any takers?

Please don't use the "don't worry, it will go senior argument" --- cause if that's true, then you still won't mind changing it.

And this one's not about $$$ or your permanent seat position over the next 3-5 years of stagnation...

...you'd still get the best lines over in HKG if you got non-vol'd due to your seniority.

Perhaps, if I saw this type of change incorporated into the FDA LOA Amendment than I would believe we actually "negogiated" some significant improvements and would see a tangible example of how senior guys are stepping up to help out in trouble times.

Final thought --- I wonder how many previously "mid-seniority" guys are "waking up" to this issue now that they may soon find themselves much more junior?

double post deleted

Yet another reason I am voting NO!!

Now that I think about, the company and the union have already established the policy of adjusting an LOA mid vote. Why not change the LOA currently up for vote.

Remember when the union and their buddies in management were sweating the original LOA vote over the 90 day invol? It took about two weeks of "that was never the intention" denials before they agreed to change the LOA during the vote. It only took the company 3 pages of legalese to make a one word pen and ink change.

Albie,

Now that the block 7 dudes are frozen for the next 5 years; looks like your the block rep most impacted by this 1 every 6 bone job.

True. However, I think there will be another dozen who pop up to fill HKG. I got a call from an MD11 guy today considering it...

Lots of folks are looking hard at the move packages and the ability to sell out of a house. I think some folks will bid out just to unload homes in areas with declining values...

Again--we'll see. My thoughts on STV are well documented.

Just because all the slots are filled does not mean that STV will not happen.

Yeah, well how about this gem?


N. Ongoing Implementation Measures
The parties recognize that the details involved in opening and operating foreign pilot bases are varied and fluid. Other measures facilitating the operation of the pilot bases in CDG and HKG and supporting the pilots based there may be implemented if agreed upon in writing by the Vice President, Labor Relations Law and the ALPA FedEx MEC Chairman.

Discuss.