I upgraded in December. Actually planned it that way since contractually they can't give you training over Christmas or Thanksgiving(and need to give you a good amount of time to go home). Worked out great! Sure December isn't the most fun time to be in MSP, but it sure is nice to guarantee the holidays at home!

How long is the upgrade class (minus the holiday breaks)?

About 2.5 weeks including the weekend breaks, pretty quick 12 working days total I believe

They aren't allowed to do this unless they have a need for you at that moment. CBA p82 #3.

Essentially they are tricking you into sitting ready reserve by holding you there for a DH.

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While I would tend to agree with you, there is of course some ambiguous language in the paragraph.


If Deadheading is the only remaining assignment prior to release, upon completion of the last operated Segment or training, the Pilot may request to be released from the Deadhead assignment(s). If no further conflicting assignments are reflected on the Pilot’s schedule at the time and there is no foreseeable need for the Pilot during the remaining Duty Period, the Company will grant such release.

They will argue this like the "live" reserve grid. Still wouldn't stop me from trying though. FWIW, I have not once had a problem being released from a deadhead at the end of a trip but it appears that might be changing.

Earlier this year the training department was so far behind it was taking six weeks, not including OE.

Won't matter for long. Wouldn't be surprised if they stop all upgrades and hiring in early 2019 when DL starts pulling 3 of our birds per month. 80% of us will be on the street this time next year and no one seems to care:confused: No one is pushing management for answers

Seriously? All contracts have termination dates and generally they either get extended or new contracts are signed with somebody else. The DL contract, as I understand it, lasts until 2020 at which time it may - or may not - be renewed, but if the latter is likely ro be phased out pretty much like you indicate over the course of another year.

Nor is DL 80% of our flying but even if it was, don't be such a Chicken Little.

600+ people with an E170/190 type currency are an asset. They have inherent value. Pilots with 121 experience have inherent value. Look at the expense all regional's are going through right now to train people.

If you want to worry about something that actually COULD hurt us, worry about the price of oil. That goes too high and ALL flying EVERYWHERE goes down, and yeah, even the majors will be furloughing again. But right now we are flying 80+ hours a month, not sitting reserve someplace getting 20-40 hours a month. That's the full legal 1000 hours a year, and every hour is making us more valuable. Barring an industry wide cutback due to oil prices, nobody is going to be on the street very long no matter what contracts reach their expiration dates.

PS: you do realize a screen name of Mainline or Suicide is likely to cause the FAA AND any mainline company that you may apply to, to question your judgement. Chicken Little's they can tolerate, joking about suicide in the post GermanWings disaster era not so much.

We're on the Titanic and you're the only one not ordering another brandy! If the ship goes down, I'll be playing the violin eating snacks with my homies. I may end up back where I came from: drinking out of a paper bag outside a McDonald's. At least they gotta better dollar menu now :cool:

Bring your concerns up to management, I'll make the popcorn :D

As morbid as this is, I agree. If I don’t get PIC time from compass, the past few years of my life were a complete waste. I chose cpz for the upgrade time and nothing else, and that’s what the majors care about. If I was a betting man, I’d say this pace has 10 months left. But here I am, hoping it’s around long enough for me to get some PIC. 100% regret coming here, but it’s too late to turn back.

You heard it here first, I’m predicting some heartbreaking cpz memos in 2019